#but i thought he was born in 1998

[cabin07slytherinblogs]

I’ve been doing a lot of research on the wizarding world and here are some canon things I have found out that I didn’t know

Molly and Arthur did not go to school with the marauders. They started in 1961.

Gideon and Fabian were between the ages of 31-41 when they died, I thought they were young like James and Lily. Molly is 2 years younger then them.

Bellatrix, Narcissa, and Andromeda all went to school with Molly and Arthur but they were sorted into Slytherin while Molly and Arthur were sorted into Gryffindor.

Bill was born in 1970, Charlie in 1972, Percy in 1976, Fred and George in 1978, Ron in 1980, and Ginny in 1981.

Molly and Arthur didn’t know that they were having a daughter until Ginny was born.

Hermione Granger is the oldest out of the three friends.

Rowling confirmed Dumbledore’s sexuality

Grindelwald and Voldemort weren’t fighting for the same things

Tom Riddle was conceived under a love potion. Some even say that’s why he can’t feel love.

Hermione became minister of magic

James and Lily had Harry at 19/20 years old

Molly and Arthur married right away after Hogwarts not wanting to waste time. They’ve been together for over 50 years (honestly goals) They also had 12 grandchildren. 5 grandsons and 7 granddaughters.

Hermione’s name means messenger.

The original timeline for the original 7 books/8 movies is 1991-1998

Remus Lupin was bitten by Greyback at age 4 (which I knew) but he was bitten because his father, Lyall, said some pretty nasty/hateful comments about werewolves in front of Greyback so he snuck into Remus’s room and attacked him as revenge

[gay-jesus-probably]

Okay so I have a lot of thoughts about the whole thing of the Gerudo being a race of entirely women, with the only exception being one man born every hundred years, and that man automatically being their king. Now this worldbuilding comes from Ocarina of Time, and there's obviously a metric fuckton of unfortunate implications there, because it was 1998. And it seems that Tears of the Kingdom is sticking with the lore of Gerudo men being extremely rare and becoming the King of their people, which once again has a metric fuckton of unfortunate implications because it's 2023 and Nintendo has somehow gotten even worse about this shit.

But let's set aside the whole... everything, and look at this from just the in-universe perspective. How does it work? I mean, it's pretty clear that there is no overlap between the kings; the old ones are normally long gone by the time a new one is born, but the Gerudo manage to take care of themselves during the hangtime. So they must have an established system of government and leadership that doesn't involve a king, and somehow that system is set up in a way that does a smooth transfer of power once a new king is born and old enough to take the throne. But why bother always declaring a random guy to be your King when you already have a perfectly functional system in place?

I mean again, the whole thing has a lot of sexist implications, but we're not looking at this from a real world context, we're examining it in-universe. And we could just go the lazy route and say that their king is in charge just because he's the only man, but I don't like that. I mean come on, the Gerudo are a race of entirely women, and most of their outside problems come from Hylian men being creepy about it. They are entirely a matriarchy; there is literally no reason for their culture to have an inherent respect for men, even if the man in question is one of them. And they're desert people; they live in an extremely harsh and dangerous landscape, if they don't have their shit together, they will die. By sheer necessity, their culture needs to put a lot of value in being practical, because if they're stupid about things, people die. They really can't afford to have a shitty leader take over, and just letting some guy take the wheel doesn't really fit with the way their culture must otherwise work.

So again, why the fuck do they bother having a King?

I think it's mainly just a ceremonial position. Yes, if the guy is a good leader he'll be in charge, but if he isn't good at being a King or isn't interested in the job... fuck it, they've already got a functional government system that's been leading their people the whole time, why fix what isn't broken? The title of Gerudo King isn't about leadership or power. I think it's more about belonging. Because the Gerudo are a culture where every single one of them can be defined in the same way... and there is exactly one exception once a century. Men are considered to be inherently outsiders at the best of times, and more often they're enemies. A man born into this culture is a natural outsider; he is completely unique, and that means he doesn't really fit into his community. And well... when someone is fundamentally different from the rest of their community, they tend to be ostracized.

So I think that's why the position of Gerudo King exists. It isn't about them needing or even wanting a man to lead them. The title of King doesn't need to involve any leadership at all. It's about giving the man born every century a place in their society. It's a way of saying yes, you are one of us, you are a Gerudo, you belong here, you are wanted and you are loved.

The Gerudo know that every hundred years, one of their children will be fundamentally different from all of his peers. And so their society is built to ensure that a child who is completely different from them will still be loved and accepted. He will always have a place in their society. He doesn't need to earn their love, he has it just for existing. These are his people.

The title of Gerudo King isn't an inherent position of authority. It's a promise of acceptance.

[cenorii]

A little theory about birthdays

I'm bored, so it's time to share my silly thoughts about when Chris, Jill and Wesker's birthdays are. The exact date of birth of Resident Evil characters has never been officially stated, but thanks to information from the games, assumptions can be made.

Be careful, there are a lot of numbers here that you can get confused about. So take your time reading this article.

So, what do we know? Officially, in re1 (1998), Chris is 25 years old, and Wesker is 38. And Jill, btw, is 23 years old. Officially, their birth years are: 1973, 1960 and 1974 (date from her grave). Let's remember these dates, they will be very useful to us ahead.

I won't use Jill's age confusion from re5 because she has the wrong dates there.

And also I won't take Chris' age info from re1, because it was already changed in re5, and now the old info contradicts the new info. Example: he is 32 years old in August-September 2006 instead of 33 because his birthday is not yet due, but he WAS 25 years old in July 1998. This is a contradiction that I will ignore. Therefore, I will calculate Jill's birthday by re1-re3, Chris's by re5, and Wesker's by re1 and re5.

Let's start with Jill.

Jill has 1974 listed, although based on her age (23) in re1-re3, it should be 1975. I tend to assume that she just hasn't had a birthday yet, so she hasn't had time to turn 24 yet. The events of re1-re3 take place between July and October, so her birthday must be after. Probably from October to December.

Now Chris.

Chris's age in re5 (2009) is 35 years old. However, 1973-35=1974, not 1973. This means that in re5 he is a year younger than he should be. It also means that it is his birthday this year, and that he has yet to turn 36. The events of re5 take place in March, so his birthday could be anytime between March 8 and December 31. However… let's remember Lost in Nightmares, the events of that DLC take place (presumably) in late August or early September 2006. It states that Chris is 32 years old, which again doesn't ring true, he should be 33. This means that even at the time of August-September, Chris still didn't have a birthday, meaning that the interval has shortened, and that his birthday could actually be from September to December.

Wesker.

He is officially 48 years old in re5 (2009). But Wesker was born in 1960, which means… 2009-1960=49. His birthday hasn't had time to come yet either. However, in July 1998, he had already managed to turn 38, so that means his birthday is between March and July.

Result: Chris's official birthday is from September to December, Jill's is from October to December, and Wesker's is from March to July.

[mcflymemes]

PROMPTS FROM PRACTICAL MAGIC *  assorted dialogue from the 1998 film, adjust as necessary

sometimes i feel like there's a hole inside of me, an emptiness that at times seems to burn.

be careful what you wish for.

wish you could believe in me.

we have to banish him.

he wants me. just me.

what was that, [name]?

you know what? i wished for you, too.

let him take me.

the nudity is entirely optional.

it wasn't me, it was you.

we'll grow old together.

can love really travel back in time and heal a broken heart?

i think if you lifted my heart to your ear, you could probably hear the ocean.

don't die on me, [name], please.

i bet we even die on the same day.

of course you're going to see me again.

hang on to your husbands, girls.

what wouldn't i do... for the right guy?

i have this dream of being whole, of not going to sleep each night, wanting.

i took an oath to uphold the law.

life is perfect.

don't do that.

i'd like to think so.

i have never asked you for anything.

i feel like i'm never going to see you again.

what are you doing?

i came here to bring in the bad guy because generally that's what i do.

sometimes when the wind is warm or the crickets sing, i dream of a love that even time will lie down and be still for.

i just want someone to love me.

i want to be seen.

please do this for me. please?

hold on just a goddamn second. one step at a time.

that's how you came to live with us.

everything is just so blissfully normal.

i wish you could see us.

they like to meddle in people's love lives.

thought you never wanted to fall in love.

you're saying what i'm feeling is just one of your spells?

fall in love whenever you can.

when you find yourself the center of attention... it's not that they hate you. it's that... well. we're different.

you have the worst taste in men.

i was born with them.

since when is being a slut a crime in this family?

you ever put your arms out and spin really, really fast?

maybe i had my happiness.

you promised me that.

so what kind of... uh... craft do you do.

yeah. it's not real.

curses only have power when you believe them. and i don't.

all i want is a normal life.

that's the point.

yeah, well, you know. all relationships have problems.

that's what love is like. it makes your heart race. it turns the world upside down.

when are you going to realize that being normal is not necessarily a virtue?

well... it's what i want.

now that was me.

i don't want them dancing naked under the full moon.

the guy i dreamed of doesn't exist.

is that why they wanted to hang her? because she's a witch?

i don't even mind the beard.

there's a little witch in all of us.

what was that?

i'll tell you all you need to know.

one step at a time.

you think he's dead?

is he cute?

you came for breakfast? we're having pancakes!

what's wrong? cat got your tongue?

someday you'll explain this all to me.

[the-cat-and-the-birdie]

This is gonna sound ridiculous but as someone born in 1998 -

In my head I always thought 'Oh, Hobie is from 30 years in the past. 1970's were 30 years ago'.

It just hit me right this moment that..

No, that... That isn't correct.

It is 2024. Hobie is not from 30 years ago. He's from 50 years ago.

Hobie literally exists half a century ago.

Y'all, I don't mean to alarm you but.. I think I might be stupid.

I know this sounds so dumb but something about Hobie being from half a century ago ykgxcyco DOESN'T SEEM RIGHT.

I associate 50 years with like UHHH soda-shops greaser era nuclear family when nah

GARFIELD THE CAT CAME OUT 1978!!

HOBIE WOULD BE 65 TODAY! (Assuming he's born in 1959)

Please tell me I'm not the only one who finds this odd 😭😭

[ameriatenebrae]

Updated version

Why was Bellamort always canon

Delphini Riddle;

I actually don’t believe Delphini was born in 1998. I think it was in 97.

The reason is that in the books, Bellatrix is absent from the entire book. (Except that event in Spinner’s End, which happened in the summer-autumn of 96 and after that we see Bellatrix at the Death Eater meeting, which happens in July 97 but that's in the Deathly Hallows).

That means Bellatrix was absent for at least nine or ten months in that book. You think that’s just a coincidence? And where was she?

In my opinion, after rereading the books for I don't know how many times now (xD) she was glued to LV, who was in my opinion, fully aware of her pregnancy. And since he was traumatized by his mother dying in childbirth (which is also implied in the books), it also makes sense that he wanted her by his side. Another thing is that he certainly didn’t want anyone to see her pregnant. Because I think the death eaters were aware of something going on between them two and LV didn’t want anyone to know that Bellatrix is, indeed, pregnant with his child.

Bella wasn’t there, when Dumbledore was killed. Which I consider strange, because if you like it or not, Bellatrix was a very powerful witch and the highest ranking death eater, considering Lucius failing LV over and over. And no, Snape wasn't the highest ranking either, since LV didn't trust him 100%. LV sent Peter Pettigrew to Spinner's End so he and Snape could spy on each other basically (xD, very mindful, Tom, very demure). (And do you know why? Because Bellatrix had been telling Tom constantly that she doesn’t trust Snape, it seemed like LV ignored her opinion but I think he rethought it and sent PP there just to be sure.)

So why on earth ?! From a strategical point of view, it doesn’t make sense for Bellatrix not to be there?! And LV was aware of that so it must’ve been his meant decision to not send her there.

Just think… It had to be something really, really important… She would’ve been there if it wasn’t.

Delphini could be born in May – June 97. (It would be actually ironic, if she was born the same day Dumbledore died, 30th June 1997… Just a thought!)

Bellamort;

Secondly, I know it’s hard for some people to accept this, but Voldemort did CARE… He maybe didn’t love her or maybe he did, in his own twisted way, because we aren’t talking about fairytale love with these two. But he certainly wasn’t ignorant towards her. (opposite of love). It was unhealthy and toxic but at the same time they were kindred spirits who just accepted each other and even tho LV would never say it out loud, they also needed each other.

“But hE TrEaTeD hER BaDLy”

When exactly did Lord Voldemort treat Bellatrix badly? I can’t recall one time he was harsher to her than to other death eaters. And if you want to bring up that scene at Malfoy Manor, when he humiliated her and the Malfoys. You're right, he did, he enjoyed humiliating people. And yet, he took the shame from her in the next few sentances and focused solely on the Malfoys, because Lucius failed the Ministy mission, not Bellatrix. And he even made it up to her in the next paragraph. He didn't have a reason to be mad at her.

He actually treated her with the most respect he could.

He never punished her badly. Not so harshly like the Malfoys. She is described as unharmed after that fiasco at Malfoy Manor. And what’s more, she is by LVs side in public shortly after, whereas the Malfoys are home prisoned and I think Lucius might've been tortured even. He personally trained her, put his energy and time into her, because he saw potential in her. He saw her madness as a source for her powerful dark magic, not something she should suppress, that’s also why she was so devoted to him. Because he was the only person who respected her for who she was. Because in the end, they were both just two extremly broken souls (pun intended).

Further:

He was the happiest he had been in 14 years when she escaped from Azkaban. You may try to say that he was happy because he had 10 more death eaters. That would make sense if the other page wasn’t talking mainly about Bella. (Remember, JK Rowling was intentional when writing, it’s not a coincidence, that she’s focusing on Bellatrix after that statement. She chose every word of all their interactions and Harry's perspective on them intentionally).

He called her “Bella”, a short version of her name, that only few wizards, mainly her family used. He even called her Bella when he was angry about the borken prophecy.

She was the only one, who wasn't scared to speak first when talking to him or touch him even when he said no.

He entrusted her with his soul, whereas he gave the diary to Lucius just to get it to Hogwarts, never telling him that it’s his horcrux. But the cup was given to Bellatrix for protection. And it’s even symbolic, because that cup was Helga Hufflepuff’s, the founder of the Hufflepuff house which stands for loyalty… and who’s the most loyal servent of the Dark Lord?

He rescued her from the Ministry, I think that’s obvious. He certainly didn’t have to. And yet he did risk the whole operation and exposed himself to the whole Ministry. And we’re still talking about the most selfish man here… but he did it… and he did it just for HER, because he CARED. There’s no other logical explanation to this. He came the second she called him and rescued her because he didn’t want her in Azkaban again.

And you can see the difference in LV's behavior towards Bellatrix, Lucius and the other DEs. He didn't help Lucius to get out of Azkaban right away. Instead, he tasked his only son to kill a man, he himself wasn't able to kill simply to mock and torture him mentally.

Yes, from Dumbledore’s words, we were made to think that Tom really doesn’t care for anyone other than himself. But Dumbledore wasn’t aware of Bellatrix’s status at all! Because he didn’t suspect that Voldemort would give his horcrux to her. But we know, Voldemort did just that. And another problem with Dumbledore's preception on this is that he didn’t know much about Tom’s life (certainly not his private life) after his years at Hogwarts, so he couldn’t know about Tom’s realtionship with Bella. It was just his opinion, not a fact. He said, he *thinks*.

And Voldemort’s reaction to her death… That made everything clear, He cared for Bellatrix more than for the piece of his own soul living in Nagini. He had a worse reaction to Bellatrix's death than to, mind you, Nagini’s death… and she was HIS LAST HORCRUX. He lost the control of his magic (which doesn't happen often, since we're talking about THE Lord Voldemort here). He was so furious that McGonagall, Kingsley and Slughorn (all three very powerful wizards) were blasted through the air because: "Voldemort's fury at the fall of his last best lieutenant exploded with the force of a bomb. Voldemort raised his hand and directed it at Molly Weasley" he even tried to avenge her death and kill Molly. If Bellatrix hadn't meant so much to him, why would he waste his energy and time on killing Molly? Have you seen him avenging the death of someone else except Bellatrix? And if Harry didn't intervene, he would do just that. Because he lost it at that point. Death took another person (first his mother), who loved and admired him uncoditionally. All of his other DEs fleed or died. He knew he was alone and mortal. A human.

In my opinion they led, let's call it a Dual Relationship. As Bellatrix implies that LV tells her everything and yet he tells her to be quiet often. He calls her Bella when they're is just the two of them and mocks her in front of others. There's a disconnect between his behaviour towards her. So, in my deduction; there was Bellatrix Lestrange, the most loyal sevent of Lord Voldemort: which was basically their work mode. (And I'm a bit sad we didn't get more of their team work while fighting because I think they made an excellent work duo.) And then there was Bella and her Lord and their private life. Bellatrix wouldn't be against it being public, I'm sure about that. But I think LV didn't want others to know about him having some feelings or a soft spot for her, it would make both of them more vulnerable = since as you can see above, he lost control over his magic because of her dying. But he didn't manage to hide it that well because even Harry (from whose perspective are the books written) notices that there is something between them; "As to a lover"...

And on top of that, Bellatrix was the ideal match for Tom; a very beautiful, powerful witch from a pureblood family. Devoted solely to him.

So Bellamort had been canon even before the CC was released.

But the biggest question is; Why would Lord Voldemort want a child? A hard one… yes

Some explanations:

a) to continue with the Slytherin bloodline.

b) it was an accident, but he let Bellatrix keep the child, so she could be later trained into really powerful weapon (just like Bella)

c) it was that reward beyond Bellatrix’s dreams, he mentioned earlier in the series. He talked about it in the fourth book when he said that the Lestranges will be rewarded beyond their dreams.

d) last possibility, the most out of Voldemort’s character; In the case horcruxes failed, he would be still “alive” through his daughter. – I personally don’t believe this was the case… but who knows?

To sum it up: Bellamort makes more sense than people think. And the CC just confirmed it. period.

Delphini could be conceived around October 1996 and could be born, not in 1998, but in 1997 (before the Battle of Hogwarts). THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR READING THIS <3

[ranticore]

inspired by a post by @/serpentface of a concept that captivated me, i'm going to present the much anticipated, much requested, "what cars my characters would drive, bearing in mind their economic status and assuming the year is 2024" post

we can start reallyyyy easy because for Bowman there's no other option:

An ep3 Honda Civic. Is it a type-R? nope but it's got vtec bro!!!! it's surprisingly practical and the wheels are kerbed to shit. there's fluffy dice. there's an aftermarket spoiler on the back and a halfords special front splitter. He's of the opinion that girls don't know the difference between a hot hatch and a grandma's car so this works as well as the expensive one. i think his driving style is best described as 'life changing'. for better or worse.

Senca:

unflinchingly practical. the car that can do it all. a 2010 1.6 TDI Skoda Octavia with roof rails. it's not about speed or looks and it's not even about transport, really, it's about looking superior because nobody else's car can fit the contents of an entire house inside. and then looking less smug when someone pulls up in a Volvo V50. the type of driver who can't fucking stand it when other people break the rules of the road but when she does it, it's fine. because she's a "good" driver.

Léa:

2004 Hyundai Coupe 2L. Yes bitch it looks fast!!!! IS it fast? No, but the better coupes from the same era did not depreciate so much in value and aren't affordable. in Léa's hands it's like a rocket ship. The indicators must be broken though because nobody has ever seen them in use. She spray-painted the wheels herself.

Islin:

a step-through road bike WITH panniers. cars damage the environment and the thought of contributing to that is unconscionable. doesn't wear a helmet anyway. dichotomy of ocd

Helena:

Porche Cayenne. Mostly someone else would drive her around but every so often she wants to get behind the wheel and start tailgating aggressively, just for the thrill of it. She replaced the stock lights with retina blaster 9000s and is always about 1 inch behind your back bumper, full beam on. Red lights are for other people. She ran over a child once because she wasn't looking and blamed the parents.

Jean-Baptiste:

Caterham 7. The one made up to look much older than it is, and he ordered it in kit car form and built it in his garage. I've always insisted that Jean would be massively into motor sport if he happened to have been born when that was a thing. He didn't follow the manufacturer's instructions because he felt that he knew best so his car is very unsafe but makes far more power than stock. It's not road legal but you will find it on the road nonetheless.

Erica:

Oh? You've never heard of it? You've never seen a man look so smug in your life. He shuts the silent-close door and explains that he traded in his Tesla model 3 for a BYD Seal because Tesla was becoming "too mainstream" and there were too many of them on the road.

Félix:

1998 Mercedes Benz E Class. Yeah it cost him £700 on Autotrader, but what's important is that it cost £60,000 when new. This is a good car. This is a luxurious car. It has heated seats - they don't work, but if he wanted to fix them he could. It has an overflowing ashtray from the previous owner and there's not a single thing that goes right on it but it makes him look adjacently wealthy, and isn't that the point? The poppy helps him look more sympathetic to elderly people (scam victims). Number One Most Likely To Attempt Murder-Suicide By Automobile. You've never seen a man look so divorced.

Carmen:

For her i just sorted price low -> high and picked the cheapest running car. And it's a Fiat Bravo! Notorious for earning a zero star euro ncap safety score and exploding into scrap if it hits a kerb. Carmen can't rely on her parents buying her a first car or paying insurance so she has no choice but to scrape the bottom of the barrel. She thinks it looks nice though.

Pascal:

was there any doubt.

Nico:

Beat up 1999 Discovery permanently attached to a horsebox. It is always filthy and somehow filled with straw and dog hair even though he doesn't own a dog, that's just what seems to happen to these cars. The heating doesn't work anymore but other than that it's fine, does the job. Drives with what can only be described as malicious compliance to all rules of the road.

Cain:

a Lada Niva. Why the hell would you ever need more than this. Electronics? No thanks. You're lucky it has gears. Cars peaked in the 1970s and anything built after that is just a piece of ridiculous frivolity, a toy for children. Here is a real workhorse. It costs 20 grand. Probably the only truly good driver here.

---

Sir Heaven:

Please for the love of god stop making him drive the Revuelto he doesn't want to do it anymore it's too scary

Sir Victory:

2003 Seat Leon Cupra R, with decals that make it seem very impressive and like it might actually be a racecar, but it isn't. It's made of rust and the engine sounds sick. It's battered and broken and the subframe is bent from a side-on collision. One day it might crumble away entirely but until then Sir Victory will drive it like he's at Goodwood. A very aggressive driver, mostly due to impatience, and he always wins the red light drag race.

Mercury:

It's a normal Ford Crown Victoria with a tank engine strapped to it. What? His holy calling is building and designing engines, of course this is safe and sane. Kind of a lackadaisical driver, obeys the rules when the mood strikes.

---

And just for fun, random other characters:

Qedivar:

1999 Audi A4. I just tried to imagine the most boring history professor tier car I could think of. It's in good condition for its age but it's never brought anyone a single scrap of joy in its entire life. Nobody smiles seeing this car and to this day Qedivar often fails to pick it out in a car park.

Huarvaa:

The legendary Renault Scenic RX4. It's big, it's 4-wheel drive, and it's a practical MPV. and it looks like it's constantly dipped in some kind of algae or perhaps sludge. Modified with a snorkel so it can drive through deep water. Still really rusty despite the plastic cladding.

Holly:

Rover Metro. It's incredibly spacious!!! Wow! He can't see over the wheel.

Finbarr Ó Casaide:

A Lupo. Literally the perfect car for his needs and he knows he must be conservative in how he goes about things. Yellow colour for the Ó Casaide clan, to show that he really does belong there, promise. A devastatingly precise driver; guns for the tiniest gaps and somehow makes it every single time, without putting others at risk or being particularly reckless. He will get you to your destination 20% faster than anyone else.

Olivier Tanet:

Ford F150, specifically an imported one from the US, specifically driven in a normal-sized place that is not built for stupid american cars (as in the photo). It is gigantic and it's in your rear view mirror 24/7. Helena might be a maliciously careless driver, but Olivier is just malicious. He wants you dead. His truck is part of an elaborate dick measuring contest that he intends to win. Plus side is that it's not a pavement princess, it goes offroad (it does doughnuts in your front garden)

[headcompost]

i just checked the CC website and noticed they say Jake is twenty three? shouldn't he be twenty five by now?

wait. haha wait.

[loukaiitis]

Kip Kinkel: Thurston High School

Summary of the 1998 Thurston High School Shooting committed by Kip Kinkel. Note: this is for informational and educational purposes only. Post is below the cut. 

Background: 

Kipland Philip Kinkel was born August 30th, 1982 to Bill and Faith Kinkel. He had one older sister, Kristin, who was about six years older than him. The family lived in Springfield, Oregon; Bill previously taught Spanish at Thurston High School and Lane Community College, and Faith was a Spanish teacher at Springfield High. Kip was described as a relatively normal teenager with some odd hobbies and interests. He was on the football team and enjoyed the music of Marilyn Manson and Nirvana. He was also known for being “obsessed” with bombs and guns; this fixation would only grow over time.

The Kinkel family did not seem to have any major conflicts. Kristin was a successful competitive cheerleader in college, and Bill and Faith were both popular teachers. However, Kip had some academic struggles. It was recommended that he repeat the first grade, and he was later diagnosed with dyslexia. Despite having difficulty in some academic areas, Kip thrived in science and math; in fact, he was placed in a “Gifted” program.

Mental Health / Warning Signs

Kip’s behavior began to change as he became a teenager. He was twelve years old when he began hearing voices in his head. The first time it happened, he was walking home from school; according to Kip, a male voice told him, “You need to kill everyone, everyone in the world.” When he could not find the source of the voice, he panicked. He ran to his house, grabbed the rifle he received for his birthday, and hid in his bedroom until he did not hear the voice. Soon, one voice developed into two, and then three. These voices were all male voices and would talk to each other: either to fight or to work together to manipulate Kip. These voices terrified him, and he tried to make sense of them. However, his conclusions were all based in paranoia.

“I believed that the Disney corporation was working in conjunction with the U.S. government, and they had planted a chip in my head and so the voices were coming from this chip,” - Kip Kinkel (2021)

This paranoia developed rapidly, but he went to great lengths to hide it from others. He began believing that foreign countries would invade and kill him. These fears led him to have an increased interest in weapons.

 In seventh grade, he expressed an interest in building bombs and tried to obtain books such as the Anarchist’s Cookbook. He obtained a shotgun from a friend during this time as well. Faith Kinkel discovered his plans to obtain weapon-related books and grew concerned. Despite knowing about Kip’s violent interests, she did not intervene. It wasn’t until Kip started getting into legal trouble that some action was taken. In eighth grade, Kinkel and his friends were caught shoplifting CDs at the local Target. Sometime after this incident, Kip and a friend were arrested in Bend, Oregon for hitting a car with a rock from a highway overpass. These incidents led to Kip being brought to a psychologist. Kip intended to keep the voices and delusions he was having a secret. Dr. Jeffrey Hick would see Kip for nine therapy sessions and noted that he showed “no evidence of delusional thinking or other thought disorder symptoms.” It was apparent that he had a strained relationship with his parents, especially after his sister (who acted as a mediator for the family) had moved out. Kip described eating and daily functioning as a chore. He was eventually diagnosed with depression and prescribed Prozac.

“I remember freaking out. I had this plan, and this is a mess, but I had this plan to get into the military because if I got in the military, then I could get into the CIA, and if I got in the CIA, then I could get the right connects to find whoever in the government that put this chip in my brain. And being diagnosed as depressed..  this was something the voices pushed.. meant that I would not be allowed into the military. And I would not be allowed to own guns.” - Kip Kinkel (2021)

During the time of these counseling sessions (January 20th - July 30th 1997), Kip was suspended twice in late April. Despite this, he was seemingly progressing well in counseling; it seemed that Kip’s depression and anger were under control. Because of this, his father allowed him to purchase a 9mm Glock with his own money (under the agreement he would not be able to use it without his father’s supervision). In an attempt to bond, Kip and his father would go target shooting. Soon after, Kip purchased more guns: a .22 pistol from a friend (which he kept hidden) and a .22 semiautomatic rifle that his father allowed him to purchase. Kip’s obsession with explosives grew just as his obsession with guns did. In class, he gave a descriptive speech about the process of building pipe bombs with detailed illustrations.

Expulsion:

On May 20th, 1998, Kip was going to purchase another gun, a .32 caliber semi-automatic pistol, from a friend; they arranged the day before for Kip to purchase it at school. Kip paid $110 for the gun and kept it in his locker. However, this gun was stolen from the friend’s father. The father contacted the school, concerned that one of his guns was taken by one of his son’s friends. A list of possible suspects was given to Detective Warthen, but Kip’s name was not listed. After speaking to other students, Warthen questioned Kip about the gun. He confessed and was arrested, along with the friend he purchased the gun from. According to Detective Warthen, Kip was extremely worried about what his parents would think of him being charged with a felony. Bill Kinkel drove Kip home from the police station. They stopped at Burger King; Bill left Kip inside the building while he ate in the car. Kip felt as though his fears had become a reality.

“It was no longer, ‘I need to get this gun to protect myself from these very specific threats.’ Everything was a threat, everything was evil, everything was ugly, I got to the point where there was a mantra that the voices were saying, but also that I was experiencing, which was that I had to commit the crimes that I committed. The sense that I had no other choice was overwhelming. It became my reality.” - Kip Kinkel (2021)

Shooting: 

According to Kip, the voices in his head continued to get louder and more unbearable. The voices he was hearing were telling him to kill his father. Around 3pm on the same day as his expulsion, Kip grabbed his .22 rifle and shot his father in the back of the head while he was drinking coffee in the kitchen. Kip dragged the body of his father to the bathroom and covered him with a sheet. Between 3pm and 6:30pm, Kip’s home phone received numerous calls: a call from an English teacher at Thurston High School looking to speak to Bill, a call from a friend of Kip asking about Bill, and a call from one of Bill’s Spanish students asking about his absence. Kip gave vague, short answers to these calls before hanging up. The final call was between Kip and two of his friends. During this call, Kip explains that he did not know that the gun was stolen, and that he had no plans to use it. According to the friends on this call, he was impatiently waiting for his mother to come home and stated that “It's over...Everything's over... it's done... Nothing matters now."

Around 6:30pm, Faith Kinkel was in the garage, getting out of her car. Kip entered the garage, told her that he loved her before shooting her twice in the back of the head, three times in the face, and once in the chest. Kip covered her body with a sheet. That night, the voices convinced him that more people needed to die.

“I know it’s really hard for people to accept and understand, but there was something very clear inside me... like suicide wasn’t an option for me until I had done this thing that they were telling me to do. And they had promised me that once I did this thing I could kill myself.” - Kip Kinkel (2021)

The following morning, May 21st, 1998, Kip dressed himself in a black trench coat and packed his .22 caliber semiautomatic rifle, the 9mm Glock, and .22 caliber semiautomatic pistol into his backpack, along with ammunition. He taped a bullet to his chest (an extra bullet to kill himself, in case he ran out of ammunition) and a hunting knife to his leg. He drove himself to Thurston High School in his mother’s Ford Explorer.

Kip parked a block away from the school and walked through the back parking lot to enter the school. In a hallway near the school’s cafeteria, Kip shot two boys, Ben Walker and Ryan Attebury with the rifle; Walker being shot in the face and Attebury on the side of his face. He continued down the hallway to the cafeteria, where he shot the remainder of the 50-round clip. Determined to keep shooting, Kip tried to use his Glock, but he was tackled by five students after one shot. Two students were killed: Ben Walker and Mikael Nickolauson. Ryan Attebury, along with 24 others, survived their injuries. As Kip was arrested, he stated he just wanted to die or be killed. 

At the police station, Kip spoke to Detective Al Warthen. He was questioned about the moments leading up to the shooting, and Kip confessed to the murder of his parents. (Most of this recorded confession can be found online). Warthen left the room momentarily, and Kip managed to grab the knife he had taped to his leg. When Warthen returned, Kip yelled at Warthen to kill him before approaching him with the knife. Warthen escaped the room and locked Kip inside; He and another officer sprayed pepper spray into the room in an attempt to disarm Kip. 

As detectives entered the Kinkel’s house, “Liebestod”, a song featured on the CD soundtrack of Romeo + Juliet, could be heard on repeat at a blasting volume. Upon entering the house, detectives found explosives in crawl spaces, the bodies of Bill and Faith, and a note confessing the murder of the Kinkel parents.

“I have just killed my parents! I don't know what is happening. I love my mom and dad so much. I just got two felonies on my record. My parents can't take that! It would destroy them. The embarrassment would be too much for them. They couldn't live with themselves. I'm so sorry. I am a horrible son. I wish I had been aborted. I destroy everything I touch. I can't eat. I can't sleep. I didn't deserve them. They were wonderful people. It's not their fault or the fault of any person, organization, or television show. My head just doesn't work right. God damn these VOICES inside my head. I want to die. I want to be gone. But I have to kill people. I don't know why. I am so sorry! Why did God do this to me. I have never been happy. I wish I was happy. I wish I made my mother proud. I am nothing! I tried so hard to find happiness. But you know me I hate everything. I have no other choice. What have I become? I am so sorry“ - Kip Kinkel’s written confession

Trial:

On June 16th, 1998, Kip Kinkel was indicted with 58 felony charges, including four counts of aggravated murder that he was originally charged with. Kip spent approximately 18 months in solitary confinement. He was kept in a juvenile detention center until being transferred to an adult county jail after his 16th birthday. Kip was evaluated by different doctors that came to the shared conclusion that he showed signs of paranoid schizophrenia. Due to his age, he was not given a formal diagnosis and was only given medication for a brief period of time. During his confinement, the voices only gained more control over Kip. 

Just days before the trial, Kip decided to plead guilty instead of going forward with an insanity defense. He felt that a mental institution would be just as bad as prison, and he wanted to avoid a stressful trial in hopes that the voices would not bother him more than they already were. 

During the sentencing, survivors, family members of the victims, and doctors testified. Many called for the harshest sentence possible. When Kristin Kinkel tried to console her brother and block out the anger surrounding him, he allegedly said, “No, I owe it to them to listen.” Kip’s defense team attempted to get a lighter sentence due to his age and mental instability. However, the notoriety of the case led to Kip receiving the harshest sentence for a juvenile. On November 2nd, 1999, Kip Kinkel was sentenced to 111-years in prison without the possibility of parole. He apologized to the survivors and families of the victims.

Appeals / Recent News:

Kip and his legal team have made multiple attempts to appeal his sentence, with no success. However, Kip has made significant progress in his life in prison. He earned his degree in global studies in 2007 and has worked as a clerk in the prison library, a yoga instructor and an electrician. Kip’s mental health has improved with the help of proper medication and therapy. He continues to advocate for criminal justice reform today. In the summer of 2021, Kip Kinkel gave his first and only interview for an article by HuffPost.

“It’s hard for me to be able to say that because, so clearly, I had so many other choices. But in that time, that’s the horror of becoming fixated in a psychotic way... I felt like I didn’t want to do what I was going to do, I had to do it. That’s what was going on in my head.” - Kip Kinkel, speaking about his crimes

[hooked-on-elvis]

"He never used his star power — never. Maybe he should have."

Actress Millie Perkins on working with Elvis Presley

Millie Perkins (87 years old) was born in May 12, 1936 in Passaic, New Jersey. Perkins is now retired from working in film and television besides a modelling career as well. After playing the title role in the 1959 movie "THE DIARY OF ANNE FRANK", "WILD IN THE COUNTRY" (1961) was Millie Perkins's second movie. She was just about Elvis' own age when they worked together. The filming for Wild In The Country took place between November 1960 and January 1961. Millie was a 24-year-old actress and Elvis turned 26 by the time the movie principal photography was finished in January 1961. In a 1990 interview she talked a bit about her impressions on Elvis Presley while working with him in the early 60s:

"Elvis turned out to be someone I liked very much. I felt there was a man with a heart and soul there who truly cared about people. Certainly he treated me as if he cared about me; there was a mutual respect between us. But his life was on a level that my life was not on. I was married to Dean Stockwell at the time, and he was — I felt like he was drifting. The guys were on the set every day, you know, wrestling on the floor. I didn’t even know what girls he was dating at the time, because it didn’t interest me, his personal life seemed so silly. And yet I knew he was a victim of it. I felt like Philip Dunne [Wild In The Country's director] fawned all over Elvis. Elvis’ attitude was — I saw Elvis looking around that set and summing up people faster than anyone else could have, and I felt that after a short period of time he was disappointed in Philip Dunne, but he was too polite and well behaved to say anything. He tried very hard to make this film better than his other movies, and you saw him trying and asking questions. And I just believe the sad thing is that [the director] did not have the ability to help Elvis through it. I remember doing this one scene; we were sitting in the truck, and we were supposed to be driving home from a dance or going to a dance, and in the script he was supposed to break into song, turn on the radio and start singing. And to me it was like, "Yuck," I was very young, and I thought, "My sisters are going to tease me, this is so embarrassing and tasteless." You see, I was a snob, too. But — and this was the nicest thing — while we were rehearsing, finally the director walked away, and Elvis looks at me and says, "God, this is so embarrassing. Nobody would ever do this in real life. Why are they making me do this?" So there we were, both of us having to do something and we just wanted to vomit. He never used his star power — never. Maybe he should have. Maybe he did it on some other level, but he sure didn’t do it on the set. I felt like he was younger than me, this very humble person who would make statements about what he believed in. And I would think, "He’s saying that to show me he’s a fine human being." All I know is that there was a person there with a refined heart and soul, and I say refined on any level you want to look at it. When you meet someone like that, you know they’re there, even if they’re sitting there eating fifteen lollipops — that’s beside the point. That’s just what they’re doing at that time, but that’s not the essence of the person. The essence of Elvis was as fine a person as I’ve ever met; he treated me as well as anyone has ever treated me in this business."

— Millie Perkins (Betty Lee Parsons in Wild In The Country) about working with Elvis Presley. This 1990's interview excerpt was taken from the book in which it was quoted, "Careless Love: The Unmaking of Elvis Presley" by Peter Guralnick (1998).

Millie Perkins as Betty Lee Parsons and Elvis Presley as Glenn Tyler in Wild In The Country (1961)

Millie Perkins as Anne Frank in George Stevens' "The Diary of Anne Frank" (1959).

[mydaddywiki]

Pat Patterson

Physique: Husky Build Height: 6'1" (1.85 m)

Pat Patterson (born Pierre Clermont; January 19, 1941 – December 2, 2020; aged 79) was a Canadian-American professional wrestler and producer, widely known for his long tenure in the professional wrestling promotion WWE, first as a wrestler, then as a creative consultant and producer ("booker"). He is recognized by the company as their first Intercontinental Champion and creator of the Royal Rumble match. He was inducted into the WWE Hall of Fame as part of the class of 1996.

I first became aware of Patterson when he and Gerald Brisco became onscreen stooges of Vince McMahon in 97. He had peeked my interest a little, then after his match with the Mean Street Posse where he took off his sweat shirt and started parodying Hulk Hogan’s flexing routine. I started putting my dick in a sleeper hold to the thought of him. It wasn’t until a few years later that I found out he was gay.

A native of Quebec, Patterson came to the U.S. in 1962 to wrestle, though he didn’t speak any English. He wrestled for regional promotions before joining WWE in 1979 as a wrestler, referee, and commentator. After his wrestling career, he worked for WWE in many capacities, including as a referee and in promotions. He was described as McMahon's right-hand man and played a crucial role in the company's massive growth. Patterson was touted as the inaugural Intercontinental Champion, credited as the Royal Rumble creator, and often described as the first openly gay wrestler.

Patterson came out as gay in the 1970s and acknowledged it on a WWE reality show in 2014. Patterson's longtime partner was Louie Dondero. Patterson said on WWE Legends' House he and Dondero were together for 40 years. Dondero died of a heart attack on June 28, 1998, the same night as King of the Ring. Patterson died of liver failure caused by a blood clot at a Miami, Florida, hospital on December 2, 2020.

Damn… The stories about this guy from WWE Ringboy scandal of 1992 to accusations of sexual misconduct and sexual assault with employees. Now all that is wrong, but If I was offered the 'push' from Patterson, I'd be world known. Just saying.

[heybrownieboy]

CHAPTER TWELVE: BECAUSE IT WAS ALL MY FAULT

POV: Written. 3rd Person.

— Word Count: 1.5K

Warnings: Mentions of suicide attempt and drugs. Mentions of kidnapping and murder.

Author’s Note: This chapter is very dialogue and thought heavy so I hope it’s not too confusing. Also, I’m sorry if there’s any grammar or spelling mistakes.

The last thing Jeongin wanted was for anyone to find out about his suicide attempt. 

He had begged his friends— plus Jaemin and Renjun— to not tell anyone. They all understood they couldn’t. If rumors broke out and the university overheard any, Jeongin could be in serious trouble. Drug abuse wasn’t tolerated at JYP—or South Korea in general— even if it was an “accidental” overdose on prescription drugs. He’d probably be suspended or maybe even expelled, and thrown into rehab. That would cost him the scholarship he worked his ass off to get. And he wasn’t going to let that happen. 

But even more so, he never wanted Chan, Changbin, Hyunjin, Felix and Seungmin to find out. 

Ever. 

He knew they would freak out. He knew they’d bombard him with a million questions. Because deep down he knew Jimin and Hanbin were right. He knew that his hyungs still cared about him, even if they did shut him out.

So Beomgyu fighting with Hyunjin in the middle of the courtyard, totally blew up everything. But, Jeongin couldn’t find it in himself to be mad at or blame Beomgyu. He knew how over protective his best friend could get. And to be completely honest, Jeongin was shocked he hadn’t lost his temper sooner. Especially since he and Hyunjin shared a few classes.

Jeongin let out a heavy sigh when he heard his phone buzz from the bathroom counter. He already knew it was one of them. All five of them had been texting him since last night. He didn’t have the strength to look at the messages. It was hard enough saying goodbye to Hyunjin. He knew that if he looked, he’d end up giving in. 

And he didn’t want to go through another heartbreak again.

“I’m going to have to block them,” Jeongin grumbled, grabbing his phone and silencing it. I’ll do it later, he thought as he stepped out of the bathroom. He head down the hallway and turned into the living room. 

The feeling of something— someone— watching suddenly washed over him. 

That’s right. I have to try to talk to whatever’s here. 

He was supposed to do it last night but, he was thrown off by his chat with Hyunjin. He had gone right to bed after that, crawling under the covers and simply lying there awake for hours. He honestly doesn’t know how long he stared blankly at his ceiling for until he managed to drift to sleep. 

Jeongin took a deep breath, walking deeper into his living room.

“If someone's here,” he said, “can you give me a sign? Maybe a knock?” 

A few moments passed and there was nothing. 

Of course there was nothing, Jeongin reprimanded himself. He shook his head as he ungracefully plopped onto his couch. Because ghost don—

His thoughts immediately halted when he heard it. It was the faintest of knocks coming from the wall in front of him. 

Jeongin blinked a few times.

Huh?

“Can you do it again?” he asked.

Not even a moment later, another knock landed against the wall, this one slightly louder. 

Holy shit! Jeongin thought excitedly. This is working!

Wait. His face morphed into a shocked expression. This is fucking working?! 

“Minho-hyung?” Jeongin asked, his voice barely above a whisper. 

Knock.

He felt his breath hitch at that.

Ask questions like Eris said, Jeongin. You need to figure out if it’s actually him. 

“I want to ask a some questions,” he began after a moment. “So maybe one knock for no and two knocks for yes. Is that okay?” 

Knock knock. 

He blew out that breath and collected himself. 

“Is this really Minho-hyung?” he asked.

Knock knock. 

“Born October 25, 1998?” 

Knock knock. 

“Loves Japanese pudding?” 

Knock knock. 

Jeongin squinted. “Has two cats,” he said, “Doongie and Dori.” 

A singular loud knock made Jeongin jump slightly. Then slowly, a grin started to make its way onto his face. 

Yep. It’s definitely Minho-hyung. Only he would totally get pissed off at that. Even Felix-hyung got threatened with the air fryer once, when he got the number of cats wrong.

“Sorry hyung,” Jeongin said, “I was just making sure it was you.” He let out a little chuckle. “Three cats. Soonie, Doongie, and Dori.” 

Knock knock. 

Okay now that we’ve established it’s really him. 

“Hyung,” Jeongin said, his voice taking on a serious edge now, “are you the one I hear pacing every night?” 

Knock knock. 

“And the humming? That was you too?”

Knock knock. 

“So you’ve been here for about two weeks?” 

Knock knock.

Why now? Jeongin wanted to asked. After a year of being gone, why now?

“I talked to a medium,” he said. “I told her that sometimes when I hear you pace, I hear chains. She said that you might have a spiritual debt. Do… do you have a spiritual debt?” 

Knock knock.

So she was right. 

“Did you commit some time of grave sin while you were living? Something we never knew?” 

Knock. 

“Is it a debt from a past life that have to pay off now or something?” 

Knock. 

Jeongin’s eyebrows furrowed together. 

Then… 

“Is it, like, a contract with something?” he asked.

Knock knock. 

“Is it a human?” 

Knock. 

“Demon?” 

Nothing.

“Minho-hyung, are you still there?” Jeongin asked after another moment of silence. 

Immediately there were two quick knocks on the wall. Jeongin shifted in his seat on the couch. 

Then, does he not know?

“Do you not know what it was?” he asked, tentatively. 

Knock knock. 

“Why?” Jeongin blurted. He shook his head. “I’m sorry, only yes or no questions.” He took a deep breath. “Is Jisung-hyung around?”

Knock.

Then maybe he found peace?

“So did he move on?” 

Knock. 

Jeongin’s eyes widened. 

Okay okay. Maybe he’s a spirit on earth like Minho-hyung?

“Do you know where he is?” he asked.

Knock knock. 

“Is he safe?” 

Please let him be safe. 

A heavy silence filled the room, causing Jeongin to start feeling antsy. 

Did he leave? 

“Min-“ 

Knock. 

Jeongin felt his heart drop. His back straightened, rigidly stiff, and he could feel the way his heart rate picked up. A million questions ran through his head. 

Why was he not with Minho-hyung? Why was he not safe? What did they do exactly? Why did they go missing in those woods that night? 

“Did he make the same contract as you?” Jeongin asked after shaking off the thoughts. He needed to stay focused. 

Knock knock.

“So he’s with the… thing you made the contract with?” 

Knock knock. 

“Do you think there’s a way to help you two? Out of the contract?” 

Another bout of silence passed. 

“You don’t know, do you?” Jeongin asked grimly. 

Knock knock.

What should I do? Jeongin thought, head dropping. Talk to Eris? Would she be willing to come here personally? She’s anonymous so probably not. Maybe a Shaman? Though a lot of Shamans are complete rip offs. Especially now a days. 

Jeongin let out a low groan, rubbing his temples in slow circles. Suddenly there was the sound of chains moving. It was only a brief moment but it was enough to get Jeongin’s attention. 

“Sorry hyung,” he said. “This is probably taking a lot of your energy, isn’t it?” 

Two knocks, much softer than the ones before, echoed off the wall. 

“Can I ask a just a few more questions?” 

Knock knock. 

“Were you two kidnapped that night?”

Knock knock. 

Jeongin winced. He took a deep breath, willing himself to ask the next question. 

“Were you murdered?” 

Only a moment after the words left his mouth, the two dreaded knocks came.

Jeongin’s heart completely shattered right then and there. A choke sob left his mouth, tears immediately springing from his eyes. 

“I’m sorry, Hyung,” he whimpered, pulling his knees to his chest. “I’m so sorry. I’m so fucking sorry.” 

The silence that filled the room was suffocating. Jeongin could barely breathe. It felt like his world had completely came crashing down. 

You knew they were dead, Jeongin. You already knew they were gone.

Because it was all my fault.

It’s my fault. It’s my fault they’re gone. I should have done something more. I should have gone after them.

Jeongin squeezed his eyes shut and took a few deep breaths, willing himself to calm down.

I have to help them. 

No matter what the consequences are, I have to help them.

Jeongin collected himself, wiping away the tears on his cheeks with a sniffle. He sat back normally on the couch, running his hands down his legs. 

“Minho-hyung,” Jeongin said finally, his voice watery and strained, “just one more question, okay?”

Knock knock. 

“It wasn’t a human that kidnapped and murdered you two, was it?”

There was a moment of silence before the sound of two knocks— now directly on the wall behind him— confirmed the suspicion that has been eating at the man for over a year. 

“Thank you, Hyung,” Jeongin said, softly. “You can rest now.” 

< Previous | Next >

Of Chaos Ans Spirits Masterlist

Taglist (Open): @lily-loves-kpop @f9clementine @bookswillfindyouaway @lilyuwon @kpopjackie @i-dont-know-me-either @tirena1 @velvetmoonlght @whiteghostt

©️heybrownieboy 2024

[chcrryade]

⠀⠀⠀ ┉ ┉ ⠀YOU’VE GOT THE BASICS, sure. But do you really know the seven? How they got here, all that they’ve been through up to this point? No, I didn’t think so. Don’t worry, I’ve got you covered. Thank me later.

your seven pack soda contains . . .

Doyeon is kind, compassionate, full of the quiet kind of confidence. Mostly free of any stains on his personality that the harsh reality of the idol world may have left. He means well, most of the time, even if he doesn’t always express that in the best way—too full of urgency to want to wait for change to happen, for people to improve. He’s impatient even with himself, even, desperate not to fall behind. Doyeon doesn’t quite think of himself as the leader the other six want, but he’s trying his best just to simply be the one they’ll come to need.

Born in February 1998, to a nowhere town in Daejeon, Doyeon had a relatively quiet life while he was growing up. It was the kind of place where everyone knew everyone, where people met up on the weekends in town halls or community centres to share coffee and cake and pour over puzzles, make idle chatter about nothing in particular. There was hardly anything to get excited about, but Doyeon didn’t really mind at the time. He liked spending his afternoons playing with his brother in the singular park, or helping his mother with dinner in the kitchen. He didn’t really need much entertainment to keep him happy in his younger years, and was perfectly content as he was.

Or at least, so he thought he was. The restlessness started to fester inside of him around the age of thirteen, and it was a slippery slope from that point onwards. He’d seen every single movie they were showing in their lone cinema more than twice over, had tried every possible position he could manage without hurting himself on the rusting swing set in the tiny park (at one point he could hook his legs over the bar at the very top and let himself hang, all of the blood rushing to his head—using it more like a gymnast than a bored child would), and was starting to get sick to death of all of the jigsaws he was made to help with every weekend. He felt a little lost for a while, drifting from mindless hobby to mindless hobby and starting to get frustrated when nothing seemed to stick. He was just sort of.. Stuck still on his feet, floating around with no real end destination in sight. Retreating into his shell, keeping his head down—that was, until he saw a rerun of Inkigayo playing on the old television strung up in the corner of their one café, and then all of a sudden he had a brand new dream, a brand new thing to strive for.

He found it was more the dance aspect of the whole idol gig that interested him the most, and so he enrolled himself into a few classes in the next town over the second he found the chance to. Dancing was all he did for the next few months, practically consuming him body and soul. On the way home from school; following whatever rhythm he could make up in his head, whatever tune he could hum under his breath. In his bedroom, diligently following along to the choreographies of his favourite songs and then sheepishly yelling an apology to his mother when she yelled at him for being so loud so late at night. Even while sitting down his feet would be moving, tapping along to a beat that nobody could hear but him. It felt like he had finally found his true calling, and it seemed that on the walk to the train station after a lesson an FNC scout thought so too. Hasty introductions were made, his hand was being vigorously shaken by a larger, slightly sweatier one, and by the end of it he had a business card tucked away into his backpack—an opportunity.

One that Doyeon, of course, took. March 2015, just after his seventeenth birthday, marked the month he made the official move to Seoul to start his life as a trainee. He dismissed his mother’s worries with the assurance that he would call every week, ruffled his younger brother’s hair just to hear his complaints, and left his nowhere town in Daejeon without a single backwards glance. That life, of course, after three years of hard work and an official debut with SLOW MOTION in 2018, would come to a rather sad end a little more than a year later in December 2019. There was no egregious scandal that tanked their popularity or vicious fight between the five members that tore them apart, but instead they just fell flat. Little interest, little sales, little point to keep them together. And so with nothing to do, and not much chance to dance in front of adoring crowds like he’d wanted since he was young, when JAGUAR approached him with an offer of joining a project they were working on in January 2020 he jumped ship almost immediately.

⠀ഒ˚ ⋆ % ⠀›⠀BASICS

STAGE NAME⠀DOYEON  ( 도연 )

BIRTH NAME⠀KIL DOYEON  ( 길도연 )

BIRTH DATE⠀11 FEBRUARY,  1998

PLACE OF BIRTH⠀DAEJEON,  SK

HOMETOWN⠀DAEJEON,  SK

ETHNICITY⠀SOUTH KOREAN

NATIONALITY⠀SOUTH KOREAN

⠀ഒ˚ ⋆ % ⠀›⠀CAREER

OCCUPATION⠀IDOL

LABEL⠀FNC  ( 2015—2019 )⠀JAGUAR ( 2020—PRESENT )

YEARS TRAINED⠀FOUR

POSITION⠀LEADER,  MAIN DANCER

DEBUT DATE⠀19 NOV,  2018⠀╱⠀1 AUG,  2021

⠀ഒ˚ ⋆ % ⠀›⠀PHYSICAL

FACE CLAIM⠀JI CHANGMIN

HEIGHT⠀175 CM  ( 5’9” )

WEIGHT⠀56 KG  ( 123 LBS )

Jalen isn’t the type to sugarcoat. His bluntness, no-nonsense attitude to most things, and general unfriendly look tend to deter people at first glance, but after taking the time to break through his walls those people usually find that he’s more fun-loving than they might think, full of passion for the things he loves. Lack of empathy is another weak point of his, though. If it doesn’t concern him, the group, or his work in particular, then the chances are that Jalen just can’t find it in himself to care. Why would he? He usually has bigger things to worry about.

Jalen was born on a late spring evening in April 1997, to a nightclub-owner of a father and a karaoke-loving and office-working mother right in the very heart of Beijing. Music, dance, and the far-too raucous laughter of the young partygoers drunkenly tottering on the uneven cobbles right underneath his window was something he grew up with, coming to know it like the back of his hand—the clattering of their shoes on the pavement a familiar rhythm in his mind. It grew to become something of a comfort, something that made him feel more unsettled if he hadn’t heard it.

With no siblings around to keep him company, and not that many close enough friends at school to bunk off classes or mess around on the walk home with, Jalen turned to music instead. At first it was just the hesitant accompaniment of his mother whenever she made use of her weekends off to spend a few hours at their local KTV, to sing whatever songs she wanted and have fun doing it, but from there it slowly began to spiral. While he grew to love singing just as much as his mother did, he also wanted to try and make some music of his own. Jalen was mostly self-taught in his endeavours, watching tutorials late into the night and messing around on his phone until he’d made something that sounded right, that sounded good. He began with simple mixes of his favourite songs, a little scared to try anything completely from scratch, but once he felt he’d got the hang of it he started to branch out a little more. He was doing short DJ sets in his fathers club from as early as the age of fifteen in 2012, slipping in a few of his original pieces just to see how well they’d go down.

Becoming an idol was never really part of the plan. He would’ve been happy to work in his fathers club for however many more years he felt he wanted to, until his mother sat him down one day in early 2013 and pointed out to him the fact that he could go so much further if he tried to get deeper into the industry rather that sticking to scratching (no pun intended) the surface of Beijing’s nightlife scene, imploring him to do more than either of his parents had. METRONOME was never really at the top of his list, either, but the auditions were the only ones he felt comfortable enough to aim for, and so on one hot summers day in August 2013 the sixteen-year-old Jalen boarded the bullet train to Shanghai and performed the best he could for the panel in front of him—nothing too elaborate, just a simple song and dance routine that he’d taken the time to learn back-to-front. 

It was apparently deemed good enough for them to take him on, and so with encouragement from both his parents he made the official move to Seoul and spent the next three years training until the eventual debut of ALGORHYTHM in June 2016. They had a successful three year run, but it only took a single member leaving and overall dwindling interest in the pathetic attempt at a last album they put out as a six-piece for the group to be disbanded and for Jalen to be left with nothing to do but make beat after beat on his shitty laptop that he stubbornly refused to upgrade and then make up choreographies for them in his head afterwards—until, of course, JAGUAR gave to him an opportunity in October 2019 that he felt he would be stupid to turn down.

⠀ഒ˚ ⋆ % ⠀›⠀BASICS

STAGE NAME⠀JALEN  ( 잘렌 )

BIRTH NAME⠀DUAN JIEYANG  ( 段揭阳 )

BIRTH DATE⠀27 APRIL,  1997

PLACE OF BIRTH⠀BEIJING,  CN

HOMETOWN⠀BEIJING,  CN

ETHNICITY⠀CHINESE

NATIONALITY⠀CHINESE

⠀ഒ˚ ⋆ % ⠀›⠀CAREER

OCCUPATION⠀IDOL

LABEL⠀METRONOME MEDIA  ( 2013—2019 )⠀JAGUAR  ( 2019—PRESENT )

YEARS TRAINED⠀FIVE

POSITION⠀MAIN VOCALIST,  LEAD DANCER

DEBUT DATE⠀12 JUN,  2016⠀╱⠀1 AUG,  2021

⠀ഒ˚ ⋆ % ⠀›⠀PHYSICAL

FACE CLAIM⠀QIAN KUN

HEIGHT⠀176 CM  ( 5’9” )

WEIGHT⠀60 KG  ( 132 LBS )

Some say Haeil used to be a little louder, but he thinks that’s just based on their preconceived notions of him. He’s jittery, stumbles over too many words in too little sentences and usually ends up just shutting himself up to save people the trouble. Anger comes quick, but regret comes quicker. But when he’s not stuttering or swearing, Haeil really isn’t that bad of a person to be around. Always ready to listen, always eager to help. Not your first choice in a crisis, but still someone you could consider keeping around for a little while longer. Not forgotten, just.. Not always there.

Hailing from the middle of Gangnam in the cold month of November 1999, with a cool and confidence-filled supermodel for a mother and a talent agent father with charisma running through his blood, Haeil had grown up in and around the complicated world of the rich and famous. And while his older sister basked in all the spare attention they naturally got as a result, Haeil wasn’t as keen. The constant cameras flashing made his eyes sting, the microphones occasionally shoved in his face on the way to school or on a simple walk to the store by eager reporters with leering grins on their faces as they asked him—a child, barely eight or nine or ten or whatever age he was when they did it—how it felt to have such influential figures for parents made him want to turn and run all the way back to his bedroom, and the general feeling of being watched everywhere he went made his skin crawl, made his stomach turn, made him want to lash out and start screaming and yelling and stamping his feet until all fell quiet around him. 

But, as it turned out, he wasn’t aware of how good he had it. January 2010 was when his life—in his words, as overdramatic as it sounds—came crashing down before him, so fast and so easily it felt like a blur. One minute he was stopping in the quaint convenience store before his train to school to pick up some lunch, and the next he was standing stock still before the newspaper rack staring at his own mother’s debauched face, cheeks streaked with ruined makeup and mouth open in an angry scream at whoever was taking her picture. ‘Model caught in cheating scandal,’ read the fine print underneath, and then he was tearing a copy out right there and then, racing to the pages that held the full story, and reading it until his eyes went fuzzy. And then he was standing to his feet, numb, buying the paper and running all the way back to his bedroom, reading the same words again and again and again until he could remember them even when his father burst into the room and snatched it from his hands, until his sister was sat by him on the mattress and telling him that it would all be fine soon. 

All the cameras, all the microphones, and all the reporters only seemed to get worse after that, multiplying tenfold. His mother was nowhere to be seen, his sister not revelling in the attention so much as she now despised it, his father was a shell of the naturally-confident man he used to be, withdrawing into himself completely, and Haeil himself wanted to scrub his own life off of his skin, out of his veins, and start all over again. That chance seemed to come only a year later, May 2011—on the tube to school, of all places, where the METRONOME representative that had spotted him had to tap him on the shoulder three times to get him to take his headphones off before he handed him a business card and asked him; “Would you like to be an idol?”. It looked like the one-way ticket to have his name be associated with something other than his mother, and so Haeil felt he could do nothing but agree in a half-daze.

The chance lasted for a while—three years, to be exact, after his five years of vigorous training. It all turned out to be useless after ALGORHYTHM fell to the wayside, after the six-piece fell into the deep end. He had wanted to be known for something that wasn’t his mother, but all that got him was then being known for being in the group that couldn’t cope after the departure of a singular member. Haeil was desperate for a third chance, another opportunity to prove himself, and so when JAGUAR approached him at the same time they did Jalen—October 2019—he couldn’t say yes fast enough.

⠀ഒ˚ ⋆ % ⠀›⠀BASICS

STAGE NAME⠀HAEIL  ( 해일 )

BIRTH NAME⠀JEON HAEIL  ( 전해일 )

BIRTH DATE⠀15 NOVEMBER,  1999

PLACE OF BIRTH⠀GANGNAM,  SK

HOMETOWN⠀GANGNAM,  SK

ETHNICITY⠀SOUTH KOREAN

NATIONALITY⠀SOUTH KOREAN

⠀ഒ˚ ⋆ % ⠀›⠀CAREER

OCCUPATION⠀IDOL

LABEL⠀METRONOME MEDIA  ( 2011—2019 )⠀JAGUAR  ( 2019—PRESENT )

YEARS TRAINED⠀SEVEN

POSITION⠀LEAD VOCALIST,  LEAD RAPPER

DEBUT DATE⠀12 JUN,  2018⠀╱⠀1 AUG,  2021

⠀ഒ˚ ⋆ % ⠀›⠀PHYSICAL

FACE CLAIM⠀GOO GUNIL

HEIGHT⠀172 CM  ( 5’8” )

WEIGHT⠀53 KG  ( 116 LBS )

Chances are that if you’ve met Yijun, you probably don’t like him. And that’s perfectly fine with him—he probably doesn’t like you either. Practically unrecognisable from the awkward, shut-off, unsure boy from his predebut days, the Yijun of now is intentionally abrasive, provocative in every way. Always ready for a fight, although he makes sure he never starts them himself—he takes pride in pushing people to their limits, getting them to blow up first and leave his hands clean from blood. There are times when he’s nicer, softer, but those are few and far between and so hard to reach that some just give up trying altogether.

Born in the busiest part of Chongqing in January 2001, as the youngest to two older sisters and a branch-manager mother too busy for her own good, Yijun didn’t have heaps in common with any of his own family growing up. His friends from school were perfectly fine, but it was all skin-deep. None of them ever wanted to hang around when classes were over, or go to the cinema when the latest flick came out, or hit the shopping streets whenever they had a little bit of pocket money to spare on the weekend. He was left to his own devices for the majority of his younger years, and so more often than not that translated into him being led awake at three in the morning with his phone propped up on his pillow while he watched music show reruns all night, eyes never once leaving the perfectly choreographed groups as they performed.

Rap in particular was always something Yijun was interested in. It was a genre that stretched far beyond his imagination, and he wanted to learn about every aspect of it: how to go fast, how to slow it down, how to keep a beat and make it sound good at the same time. How you could mumble, words barely intelligible, and still make something worthwhile—however niche the audience for it might’ve been. He liked it so much he wanted to try it out for himself, bit by bit, putting all that he’d seen and heard into practice. It was always in the quiet confines of his bedroom, always with only himself as the audience to listen to whatever words came out of his mouth, but it was still rap, and slowly he began to find his own rhythm, figure out a flow of his own.

He practised until he thought he was good enough, took to taking any free sample beats from SoundCloud that he could get his hands on and rapping over them, uploading them onto his own account even if a grand total of 12 people ever bothered to listen. He practised and practised and practised until a calm summer day in July 2016, when he was sitting waiting for his bus after school and a poster caught his eye. It was a little old, clearly having been there a while and also having suffered through the many weathers of his city, but the writing was still legible. JAGUAR AUDITIONS, in faded black, with the times and dates written underneath. And while Yijun had never really been into anything spiritual, nor the ‘divine interferences’ his oldest sister seemed to be so obsessed with, it was as if it had been sitting there just waiting for Yijun to find it, and he wasn’t going to do such a thing as to ignore such a glaringly obvious sign as that one.

So he skipped school one early autumn day in September 2016, caught the train armed with only his phone and the clothes on his back, barely having enough money for a train ticket, and walked into the auditions room like he owned the place. From there all he had to do was wait for his turn in line with all of the other hopefuls and pray he didn’t forget all the words to his intended audition song, pray he was able to put all the things he’d learned in the time leading up to that very moment to good use. When his turn finally arrived he looked them all dead in the eyes and hoped they couldn’t tell how anxious he was, trying not to lose his nerve before he opened his mouth.

By some miracle, it was enough to convince them, and he was packing up all the things necessary to make his move to Gangnam as soon as possible. His mother accompanied him on the plane ride over, gave him a short hug for the first time in what felt like years, and then he was left to his own devices all over again—only this time he had a routine to stick to, alongside all the other hopefuls that were just as desperate for a chance to debut as he was. Yijun was practically over the moon when he was picked to be in a group named BONSOIR, with three other trainees he’d grown to cherish, but all that excitement disappeared after the sudden (and completely unwanted, on his part) addition of Jaehee in December 2018—a blatant outsider, someone that, to him, didn’t fit in with the rest in the slightest. He didn’t care all that much about the article in March 2020 that was known to many as the one that led to BONSOIR’s downfall because, to him, BONSOIR wasn’t the group it was intended to be at all if Jaehee was there. He also wasn’t the happiest when, shortly after the five-piece officially disbanded in May 2020, he was given the offer to join the growing lineup for CHERRYADE, but he did it anyway—if only to terrorise Jaehee just a little more.

⠀ഒ˚ ⋆ % ⠀›⠀BASICS

STAGE NAME⠀YIJUN  ( 宜君 )

BIRTH NAME⠀QIAO YIJUN  ( 喬宜君 )

BIRTH DATE⠀26 JANUARY,  2001

PLACE OF BIRTH⠀CHONGQING,  CN

HOMETOWN⠀CHONGQING,  CN

ETHNICITY⠀CHINESE

NATIONALITY⠀CHINESE

⠀ഒ˚ ⋆ % ⠀›⠀CAREER

OCCUPATION⠀IDOL

LABEL⠀JAGUAR  ( 2016—PRESENT )

YEARS TRAINED⠀THREE

POSITION⠀MAIN RAPPER,  CENTRE

DEBUT DATE⠀22 OCT,  2019⠀╱⠀1 AUG,  2021

⠀ഒ˚ ⋆ % ⠀›⠀PHYSICAL

FACE CLAIM⠀ZHONG CHENLE

HEIGHT⠀176 CM  ( 5’9” )

WEIGHT⠀58 KG  ( 128 LBS )

Minhui has a permanent grin on his face, spontaneity running through his veins. It might get a little overbearing, but if people just ran with it he’d become pretty easy to deal with. He’s bursting at the seams with ideas, overly restless from the years of not being able to put them to use. Prone to disappearing, to egging on any budding fights he sees, always making sure to take the side he usually knows full well is in the wrong—because he thinks it’s fun. Maybe not a particularly trustworthy person, with how flighty he is, but he’s certainly a fun time.

On a sticky summer night in Chiang Mai was when Minhui was born, June 2002. Despite his Thai hometown, he was born to two Korean parents (an eccentric traveller of a mother and a stay-at-home father who would willingly follow her wherever she wished to go next), and grew up having to juggle between speaking one language at school and with his friends and another at home, with his family. This didn’t last forever, though, because in February 2010, at the age of eight, their family of four (extended by the original three when his younger brother was born, when Minhui was seven and very much against the prospect of having to share a home life with a screaming, wiggly little thing he’d have to call his sibling) packed up and moved to Yangsan, in a country that was technically his homeland but didn’t at all feel like it to him at the time.

Yangsan lasted for barely a year. Just when he’d been settling in properly, learning how to talk like the boys at his school did, how to leave his tie loose around his neck like they did, how to act like they did, they were handing in their final rent payment and making the move to Jeonju. And just when he was finally making closer friends, getting to know the twists and turns of their small neighbourhood like the back of his hands, they were packing up yet again, and Suncheon was his newest home at the age of eleven. He almost didn’t dare to breathe, worried to say a singular word to any of his classmates in fear he’d get told the very next day that they had a new apartment waiting for them in another city—and he was right for it. Ulsan came just a month before he turned twelve, May 2014, and it was there that he and his family—the only people that hadn’t changed over the years, his meek father and over-the-top mother and irritating younger brother—finally settled.

So he let himself adjust, let himself settle in. He made friends, got comfortable, and soon it felt just like he’d been there since the day he was born all over again. Minhui’s days were spent joking and laughing and play-fighting, slipping out of the school gates before the first bell rang to the nearby arcades and basketball courts and crowding up against each other with someone’s phone propped up on a park bench as they tried to learn the latest choreographies to their favourite songs, and then lying through his teeth with a smile back home about all the things that he was supposed to have learnt that day in lessons. His audition came about in a similar way—it was a mild April afternoon in 2015, while he and his friends were bunking off, wandering through the city streets, and one of his friends saw a sign advertising walk-in SM auditions, hitting Minhui on the shoulder to grab his attention. “I dare you to try it out,” was what he said, and Minhui was never one to back down from a dare. It seemed that his mostly-freestyled dance routine to a popular boy group song he just couldn’t seem to get out of his head was good enough for the panellists sitting in front of him, because the next thing he knew he was being told he should be expecting a callback. What followed came in what was, to him, mostly a blur—the goodbyes, the moving into dorms, the practice, day in and day out. The eventual August 2016 debut.

He was perfectly content there, happy with both his members and his group and all the multiple subunits he was given the opportunity to debut within—until he just.. Wasn’t, anymore. Minhui himself didn’t even really know what changed, but what he did know was that he just didn’t feel right there anymore. Didn’t feel like he quite fit in with the rest. So when JAGUAR got in contact with him around July 2020 requesting his presence in a lineup for a group set to debut in August 2021, it was all he could do to agree. He doesn’t regret a thing, and would make the exact same decision even if he was given a chance to go back.

⠀ഒ˚ ⋆ % ⠀›⠀BASICS

STAGE NAME⠀GOGO  ( 고고 )

BIRTH NAME⠀HWAN MINHUI  ( 환민희 )

BIRTH DATE⠀16 JUNE,  2002

PLACE OF BIRTH⠀CHIANG MAI,  TH

HOMETOWN⠀CHIANG MAI,  TH

ETHNICITY⠀SOUTH KOREAN

NATIONALITY⠀SOUTH KOREAN

⠀ഒ˚ ⋆ % ⠀›⠀CAREER

OCCUPATION⠀IDOL

LABEL⠀SM  ( 2015—2020 )⠀JAGUAR  ( 2020—PRESENT )

YEARS TRAINED⠀TWO

POSITION⠀MAIN DANCER,  LEAD VOCALIST

DEBUT DATE⠀25 AUG,  2016⠀╱⠀1 AUG,  2021

⠀ഒ˚ ⋆ % ⠀›⠀PHYSICAL

FACE CLAIM⠀YEOM TAEGYUN

HEIGHT⠀176 CM  ( 5’9” )

WEIGHT⠀54 KG  ( 118 LBS )

Jaehee was just a boy trying to get people to remember his name, and that want was what ended him up where he is now. It’s not every day a washed-up extra makes the decision to jump ship into the idol industry, and sometimes he feels he would’ve been better off with an instruction manual. Jaehee is someone a little desperate for approval, needing to please. He’s nice enough, but he’s also very touchy, temperamental, quick to tears and bursts of childish anger that he’s often too stubborn to properly apologise for—but he probably wouldn’t even if he wasn’t that stubborn, because he thinks they’re all perfectly justified.

Suwon was where Jaehee was born, in the month July 2002. As a child he only had his mother, his father having parted ways with the two of them in exchange for a new job in America. He was content with just the two of them until April 2009, when his mother had apparently decided she wanted someone new in the picture. She remarried in the spring, and he was suddenly having to make nice with his new older step-brother and younger step-sister, as well as his step-father. It was a hard change for Jaehee to get used to, and more often than not he felt left out, isolated from the new family of four as the forgotten middle child. He started to retreat into himself more from those years onward, only really leaving his bedroom for school or for the odd errands he was being made to run. There was nothing much to do except watch dramas and movies all day, and it was then that he gradually began to come to the realisation that he wanted to try it out. The idea of pretending to be a different person, even if it was only for an hour or two in a school play or make-believe scenario with only himself involved, was something Jaehee found he liked the idea of quite a bit.

He began acting by joining the drama club in school, and threw his all into it immediately. There he wasn’t the quiet Jaehee, the one that barely greeted his mother and step-father when he got home before rushing up to his room and kicking the door shut behind him, not coming out until dinner, but instead he could be the sociable one, the one that greeted everyone with a smile and always had friends hanging off of either arms, conversation flowing like second nature. He first got asked whether he wanted to be a real actor in January 2015, after a scout had been sitting in the audience of one of their school plays, and couldn’t be happier about it. From there it was a lot of forms and paperwork and older, far more important people than the talent scout he’d first been in touch with asking about where he wanted to go with his career, and him having to leave all of his school friends behind to enroll in a proper acting school, and lessons on etiquette and respect and a whole number of other things that made his head spin. Still, he loved every minute of it, and isn’t too ashamed to admit that he cried when he landed his first role—even if it was a minor one, with only a handful of lines, it was a role all the same.

The want for change came around three years later, early 2018. It wasn't like he’d lost any of his love or passion for acting, but it was more that he felt he wasn’t going anywhere. All the roles he landed were background character after background character, extra after extra, and he was starting to get a little more than sick of it. He wanted something different, a complete cleanse. A challenge. That thought process was what led him down a year-long spiral that eventually landed him at JAGUAR in December, where he had to take a moment and ask himself if the life of an idol was what he really wanted.

But, at the end of the day, Jaehee didn’t think it would be too much of a high hurdle to jump over. He already had the whole pretend-to-be-a-different-person act down to a T, and the rest could be learnt and improved on with time, as was the same with any sort of skill. And so he signed the form, began to train, and it was then decided after only a little while he would be officially debuting with BONSOIR in October 2019. Jaehee was wary, aware of the single they’d already released as a four, and for good reason, too—it was like they all couldn’t stand the sight of him, bar maybe Hyeonmin on good days. It was like walking on broken glass barefooted every day with them, and when the article that ripped back the curtain on how he was treated was released he could admit (even if it was only to himself, only under the duvet of his rickety bed in his dorm room) that he was a little relieved. And that relief only grew when he was told he was then going to be in a shiny, new, group—even if Yijun (the one who, without a doubt, hated him the most) was going to be right there with him.

⠀ഒ˚ ⋆ % ⠀›⠀BASICS

STAGE NAME⠀JAEHEE  ( 재희 )

BIRTH NAME⠀AHN JAEHEE  ( 안재희 )

BIRTH DATE⠀8 JULY,  2002

PLACE OF BIRTH⠀SUWON,  SK

HOMETOWN⠀SUWON,  SK

ETHNICITY⠀SOUTH KOREAN

NATIONALITY⠀SOUTH KOREAN

⠀ഒ˚ ⋆ % ⠀›⠀CAREER

OCCUPATION⠀IDOL,  ACTOR  ( FORMER )

LABEL⠀JAGUAR  ( 2018—PRESENT )

YEARS TRAINED⠀TWO

POSITION⠀LEAD RAPPER,  VISUAL

DEBUT DATE⠀22 OCT,  2019⠀╱⠀1 AUG,  2021

⠀ഒ˚ ⋆ % ⠀›⠀PHYSICAL

FACE CLAIM⠀CHOI HYUNWOOK

HEIGHT⠀181 CM  ( 5’11” )

WEIGHT⠀70 KG  ( 154 LBS )

It’s unusual for Hasun to speak up about anything. He’s the fresh meat, the newbie; and acts the part he’s been given, almost always keeping his head down and himself to himself. But that doesn’t mean he’s shy, or the innocent figure the public have painted him to be. For all that he’s not speaking, he’s watching—observing. He’s witnessed his fair share of distasteful things that go on behind closed doors, and sometimes sits and wonders when they’ll become a part of him, too. Wonders if there's an initiation for that sort of thing, for the moment when he does something he won’t be able to come back from.

Hasun wasn’t born into any sort of stardom—far from it, actually, with a mild-mannered librarian father and a mother that passed away a mere few months after he was born into a quaint neighbourhood in Incheon, August 2003—but he was very close to it. His father’s sister just so happened to be the mother of one Choi Yoonhae, who in around 2015 would reach his peak as JAGUAR’s most successful (and only) soloist, claiming his place as reigning king over the quickly deteriorating duo JUST4U. His older cousin was what inspired him to want to be an idol in the first place. He wanted to sing just like him, dance just like him, succeed and soar to heights that at the time felt unattainable just like him.

Singing was where he thought to start. In the shower to instrumentals of his favourite songs, under his breath while studying or doing odd jobs in the library that his father worked at, at the noraebang after school with his friends, belting out the lyrics louder than all of them put together. It was like his lifeline, and he was biting at the bit to be able to audition for JAGUAR. His father finally let him a month after his thirteenth birthday in September 2016, on the strict condition that Yoonhae and his younger sister, Eunhee (who had just recently started to work at the company also) were to watch over him any time they got the chance to make sure he was settling in alright. He painstakingly chose a song to audition with, practised it until he could sing the verses in his sleep (with a little dance to go along with it, a number he did so many times he almost wore out the soles of his favourite trainers), and his father came with him to the audition hall to cheer him on and treat him to hotpot afterwards.

When he finally got the news of his acceptance, he nearly cried out of joy. Despite it being a generally well-known fact that trainee life wasn’t always the best of experiences, Hasun loved every minute of it—turning up to every practice with a grin so wide it looked as if his face hurt from the force of it. Even when he was deemed not the right fit for BONSOIR did he become disheartened. He just kept on going, smiling all the while.

That was, until Yoonhae was found to have taken his own life in his penthouse apartment on a cold morning in November 2018. However much JAGUAR tried to sweep all news of it under the carpet, keep as much press away from it as possible, it still happened. And the worst part of it was the fifteen-year-old Hasun was standing outside the very block of flats the morning it was discovered, Eunhee by his side as they stared on in shocked silence. He almost went through a complete personality shift then, withdrawing into himself completely. There was no sunny smile anymore, and no laughter either.

But despite all of this, the tragedy that had befallen his family and himself, Hasun stayed. It took a good year or so after Yoonhae’s death for it to happen, but he started to gradually improve again, small smiles making their appearances and mood seeming to brighten up, however slowly it was happening. He’s certainly not the same person as he was when he was thirteen, but he’s trying his best to be someone like it.

⠀ഒ˚ ⋆ % ⠀›⠀BASICS

STAGE NAME⠀HASUN  ( 하선 )

BIRTH NAME⠀LEE HASUN  ( 이하선 )

BIRTH DATE⠀7 AUGUST,  2003

PLACE OF BIRTH⠀INCHEON,  SK

HOMETOWN⠀INCHEON,  SK

ETHNICITY⠀SOUTH KOREAN

NATIONALITY⠀SOUTH KOREAN

⠀ഒ˚ ⋆ % ⠀›⠀CAREER

OCCUPATION⠀IDOL

LABEL⠀JAGUAR  ( 2016—PRESENT )

YEARS TRAINED⠀FIVE

POSITION⠀MAIN VOCALIST,  MAKNAE

DEBUT DATE⠀1 AUG,  2021

⠀ഒ˚ ⋆ % ⠀›⠀PHYSICAL

FACE CLAIM⠀LEE SOHEE

HEIGHT⠀176 CM  ( 5’9” )

WEIGHT⠀52 KG  ( 114 LBS )

[batsplat]

hi! I don’t know if this is the type of question you’d like to answer, but I was thinking about how being born in the same year would have affected valentino and marc’s careers (as in both born 1979). would they or could they have started in the same year? would they be teammates at honda, and if so, would valentino still make the switch to yamaha? how does this affect rivalries with other riders? I just think it’s interesting to think about!

it sure is interesting to think about!! tossing it under the cut because this gets long and kinda dumb

well, look, let's set some basic conditions here. first of all, obviously we don't know if 1979-born marc reaches the same level of success because of how the sport changes over time, everything is super circumstantial, what even is 'talent' bla bla bla (kinda the stuff I talk about here). he can't use his signature riding style on those bikes, demands of the bikes are different, competitive ladders are different, local motorcycling scene is different, etc etc etc... hey, by the same token, maybe he'd be even more successful and would never lose a race. we're going to throw out all that nitpick-y shit and assume that he makes it to the top of the sport. we're also going to assume that marc and valentino are both able to compete with each other on relatively equal terms and go from there. we'll obviously never know either way, but this is the most fun way to approach it, like obviously either 'marc wins zero titles' and 'marc wins ten consecutive titles' are deeply unsatisfying outcomes... I do think you can get fun and nerdy into figuring out how exactly their respective strengths and weaknesses as riders compare, what their title fights might look like, the nitty gritty of which tracks they'd beat each other at... but I reckon this post is probably long enough as it is, so I've mostly skipped over those bits. they both win some titles, that's what we're going with

the precociousness question is interesting because, again, obviously marc's development timeline would inevitably look at least somewhat different in this universe. would he start grand prix racing a little later? would he need a little longer to adapt to those 500cc bikes than he does to motogp bikes? who knows. let's just play this the most simple, straightforward way possible and again assume he hits his early career milestones at the exact same rate - most importantly, of course winning the premier class title as a 20 year old rookie. it's an editorial choice that lets us skip to the fun stuff

so, the fun stuff. let's compare and contrast their journeys to the premier class:

top row is ages, bottom row is years in this timeline, the cells indicate championship positions, the colours indicate class (green = 125cc; blue = 250cc; lavender (?) = 500cc)

this actually works out quite nicely! they're not even really encroaching on each other's titles at this stage. if you really want to get into 1998 lore, obviously that title becomes way more complicated... aprilia is the strongest team, they had that 'super team' set up already filled up, do they supply four guys? is marc somewhere else? does valentino have worse machinery in that year? one of the two other guys? who knows, and also this feels like maybe a tangent for another day. let's assume they're both competitive here, and then it doesn't really matter so much if valentino ends up p3 in that championship - crucially, he still needed a big chunk of that season to adapt to the bike

so then! let's start with this time period, and rattle through some random thoughts about what the competitive landscape looks like pre-2001:

if marc is that good that early, he kinda hogs up a lot of the limelight. some folks took a bit of a punt on valentino in 1996 to get him into gp racing - yes, there were already signs of something special, but it was still all a bit more uncertain

so valentino is basically always in the position where he's hunting marc... he's constantly a step behind

now, it's actually possible to wager a good guess at how he reacts to that! the answer is 'not great': when he was constantly asked about biaggi, whether he was the biaggi of 125cc and all that, he came out with the line that biaggi would dream of being the valentino rossi of 250cc. in this timeline, I don't think the biaggi thing completely goes away because that's still italy's darling... but the first point of comparison would always be marc. and valentino unsurprisingly doesn't enjoy always being second best

of course, they do have enough overlap in the lower categories that they do actually get to fight each other on-track. 1996!valentino was, as he describes it, "an absolute pest". even though he only finished in ninth in the standings, he did get a win and was often in the front-running group, so let's say they do have a few on-track run in's during 125cc. chuck those two together as seventeen year olds, and this sounds like *checks notes* a bit of a health hazard. there is a genuine argument to be made that valentino is worse at this stage - from oxley's reference book about france 1996: "valentino was once again in the mix at paul ricard, ducking and diving in the midst of a leading group that numbered up to 16 riders, but he was riding harder than ever, using all the kerbs and then some and occasionally kicking out at rivals with his knees and elbows"

marc likes to respond to aggression by one-upping his rivals, so this feels like it just goes wrong. several times. while they're still in 125cc. also, marc is mostly winning that year, which really lights up valentino. if anything, he'd probably be even more motivated during those years, because now he's got someone to chase and someone he would just love to piss off

let's say marc still narrowly misses out on a rookie 250cc title in large part due to injury. they spend a year together in that class too, where valentino is doing a lot of learning - but is a frontrunner basically from the word go - and marc is going for the title properly now. they have a lot of intense annoyingly tactical battles this year, plenty of dramatic last lap battles, and it takes valentino around half the season until he starts winning some of these (irl, he won one of the first ten races of the season and then the last four - and also crashes a lot. marc was the class of the field)

this is the year in which marc is just... a lot. plenty of controversy!! practise crashes! back of the grid penalties! and if marc does stuff like 'trying to run his rival off-track', there is a bit of a risk valentino attempts to one-up him here. they are both starting to get real reputations, and valentino's probably gets worse by association lol

then marc heads off to the premier class. valentino dominates his 250cc title, but he's being overshadowed by marc doing the thing. which means he will be extremely fired up once he gets to the premier class himself... which might not actually help him. too much exuberance on those 500cc bikes sounds like a recipe for painful crashes

let's assume marc dominates the first half of that season and it takes valentino a while to get going. the second half is more competitive when valentino finally clicks with the 500cc's and marc starts making more errors... setting up what's to come

let's also say marc immediately gets to the repsol honda team because they really want the next big thing and the contract situation is different from when valentino joins a year later - whereas valentino still gets a shell satellite team set up for himself in 2000. he's still obviously highly rated by honda and they still give him doohan's old crew and presumably quite heavy factory backing... but there's also not quite the same urgency in the succession planning. you kinda want to sign the kid so nobody else gets him, right, and he did beat marc a few times at the end of 1998... who knows who ends up turning out better, yeah? but at the end of the day, marc is still Plan A and he seems to be working out pretty well for them

this is all well and good, but obviously a rivalry is a bit more than just a general vibe and on-track incidents and a list of results. so, my general thesis for how this relationship goes is that it kinda oscillates between 'pretty good vibes!!' and 'breaks your geiger counter'. this goes in cycles of about 2-3 years, becomes a lovely soap opera for the paddock to follow. so let’s say for instance that they go through a rough patch in 1998, and then again in 2001, and then again 2003-04, and so on…. then you get marc’s injury years and from then on it gets proper messy

so, here's a stab on what the interpersonal vibes look like during the early years:

valentino embraces the underdog position. you get this with the biaggi stuff but also you get it throughout his career... he actually likes it! he's so much about surprising people, subverting expectations, proving them wrong... he thrives in the role where everyone thinks marc is going to be the next big thing and dominate the sport for fifty years

he does also have the potential to be a major thorn in marc's side, especially if the title fight is as close as marc's canonical 125cc title was. but they do run into the same problem here that they unfortunately will always run into: they get on as people! their chemistry has never actually been an issue. back then, you'd also get more like... socialisation in the paddock... it's a bit more casual, less professionalised, they hang out more and are teenagers and are both young and annoyingly good and eventually get to that irritating 'you're the only bitch in this house I respect' thing

valentino is still very good at making marc laugh, and seems to find marc funny too so. that's a thing. marc canonically glomps onto a very small number of people, and he's already shown in real life one of those people can absolutely be valentino. we all know what we're here for and it's the most BORING outcome if they're just indifferent towards each other. but why would marc be! of course, he's completely taken in by the super talented charming rival who is actually willing to match his viciousness step for step. he wants to fight valentino forever and ever

marc does really want to be friends... once he knows valentino he decides he really likes him... sometimes he's a bit oblivious to how tough he's making valentino's life, sometimes he's wilfully disinterested... valentino is sucked in a little bit in spite of himself, though I still reckon valentino's cynicism about friendships with rivals was learned over time (hey ho sete). at the start, valentino is happy enough to be friends with his close rivals, and really it's only later that all those subconscious issues of keeping rivals at arms' length develop. he's there to have fun! it might be vicious on-track, but it's a party off-track!

and he thinks it'll totally be fine!! he's not adverse to chatting up rivals and trying to get a sense of how they tick for future reference... some of the stuff marc does bothers him, but it's not like he can immediately even articulate why. and it is tough, with how marc has long been the chosen boy... just how brutal marc gets when valentino gets close to beating him... and usually valentino reacts Just Fine to that, but he does file it all away for future reference, because he sure doesn't think marc is reacting that way to just anyone on-track...? and then sometimes marc is perceived as a real rival, sometimes he just makes valentino uncomfortable, and valentino suddenly remembers that Actually, this is a Work Relationship. in general valentino runs very hot and cold with marc, in a way that does make sense according to his internal logic but can get very confusing to anyone else, not least marc

the slight mismatch between their rates of progression also gives you these gap years where they're not directly competing... and valentino is really coming into his own in 1997. so, yes, valentino is constantly chasing marc from a competitive standpoint... but marc is watching valentino's celebrations and thinks they're just like. the best thing ever. accidental valentino rossi fan, poor soul. a big fan of the hairstyles and will enthusiastically defend them to any critics, including that one time when one of his parents made a derogatory remark about the green hair

what if they're proper friends in 1997 (age eighteen) and hung out and gone to parties together and gotten drunk and have just become Real Actual Teenage Friends while they're not racing each other... when marc gets his diplopia, what if valentino is kinda freaked by this, he'd been planning to get to 250cc to beat marc's ass next year... what if he goes to visit marc, what then...

still, this is probably around the time when valentino first says mildly annoying stuff about marc to the press (going by the biaggi precedent), which is how you set up them really going at it in 1998. it gets vicious... but also, they're young, they do kinda get over it, and then marc progresses to the premier class and they can just socialise normally again... all the while, valentino is watching what marc is doing and thinking about just how badly he wants to beat marc

valentino's rookie campaign in the premier class is also fine - because valentino is too busy adapting to the bike, marc is dominating, and traditionally those are not the circumstances in which valentino picks his fights. they have a lot of fun here together, and they're both very generous about each other's successes. marc is so impressive, I can't compare myself to him yet, valentino's adapting so well to the premier class, he'll definitely be fighting for titles soon, etc etc. fair fights (by their definition of 'fair', anyway) and them both being really complimentary towards each other afterwards. everyone who wanted beef is disappointed and disgusted, but at least you've still got the vale/biaggi thing going on in the background (btw marc also for SURE would've picked a fight with biaggi in 1999, so they can bond over that and pointedly chat to each other in pressers while ignoring biaggi)

valentino's ability to make marc laugh is particularly lethal in this year, because valentino’s struggling just enough that maybeeeee marc is being suckered just a little into thinking he’ll always have valentino covered. so he can just let himself have fun with valentino without feeling too threatened... this sets up the title fight in the following year being a complete and utter nightmare… late 2000 is already ringing a few alarm bells when marc’s results start getting messier and valentino is clearly finally properly getting to grips with the 500cc bikes (first dry race win late that year). oh well! I'm sure their relationship will survive just fine!

and then... well, again, super conveniently, valentino's first premier class title at age 22 matches up with... you know. marc's 2015

let’s just say marc does suffer a bit of head loss when he encounters his first real challenge in the sport, when there’s finally a bit of real adversity after so much success. valentino wins the first few races while marc has some patchier results, and then marc kinda tries too hard to close the gap - and then, whoops, he’s gone too far and he’s left himself with too much work to do. I did run the maths for their average points at xyz age just to have a rough measure of how the seasons compare… as in how valentino’s compare to valentino’s and marc’s compare to marc’s, because any comparison between the two is completely meaningless, very different competitive pictures. that being said, fun fact: biaggi actually scores slightly more average points per race in 2001 than marc does in 2015. still, I don’t really believe you can get marc to sepang 2015 that title fight, just isn't close enough… the marc/valentino relationship does still sour, but it’s because you get an assen equivalent... valentino wins in a slightly dubious manner, and marc doesn't react well... after which valentino goes ‘aha so it’s all right until I’m winning, yeah?’

valentino in this timeline has just like. such a massive victim complex. helps fire him up that everyone’s constantly underrating him NOBODY believed he could ever take on marc (this is mostly not true). the way the assen 2015 equivalent plays out is not just ‘what a sore loser’ but also ‘MARC NEVER BELIEVED I WAS GOING TO BE A SERIOUS THREAT AND THIS PROVES IT’. it’s like… deeply insulting to valentino and also triggers the bit of valentino’s brain where he has to prove everyone, most of all marc, wrong. that's how you get the interpersonal hurt! valentino fully believes marc has switched up towards him and can't handle any version of their rivalry where marc doesn't have the upper hand. and marc does need some time to get over it and maybe he did write off valentino just a teensy bit but also... this is just how he competes... he thinks of a lot of things as 'fair game' that others don't... and he does also view valentino differently when he's a real competitor, so valentino isn't even completely wrong... marc does react badly to losing for the first time... but it's also more complicated than that, because marc is genuinely fond of valentino and really does want to put all that aside when the title fight is over again, except valentino thinks marc has shown his true colours. whips this controversy out later on in the season as he has a habit of doing, presumably when there's not even really any title fight impetus because that's been mostly wrapped up. (which would be a bit unusual for him but, hey, he's young and silly, he doesn't start feuds in Sensible Ways back then.) so they just kinda both end up escalating it and making it ugly, and by the end of the year it's all a mess. without any competitive justification... it's a bit argentina 2018 vibes, like there's not really any point to it apart from how they both drive each other insane occasionally. big public controversy. nobody wins here!

my guess is that the general pattern of this relationship is that it’s fine any time marc has a clear edge, and devolves every time valentino challenges him. this isn’t necessarily because I think marc throws a fit every time he’s challenged - it’s primarily because valentino prefers to attack from a position of strength. basically, if you want to get something proper nasty from him, you either need to get him with his back against the wall where he reckons blowing shit up is his best choice… or you wait until he has the upper hand, at which point he attempts to press home his advantage. bite harder when the opponent is already bleeding, if you will. a big believer in being a mean winner over being a sore loser, valentino is, and you do see this trait at various stages of his career. also, mostly there has to be a competitive justification to start drama? if he can't fight properly on-track, then why bother? so at times, it’s all civil on the surface when he’s on the back foot… but when he’s on top or close to the top, then the knives really come out. incidentally, this is one of the reasons why irl he was relatively restrained with marc post-2015 (look, I’m aware it might not seem like that but he definitely was way less indiscriminate with the snide jibes lobbed at some of his other rivals than he was with marc). there was never a situation where it really felt worth it with marc, and it’s just… a better look to have a go at your opponent when you’re winning, right? in this alternate timeline, there absolutely are times when valentino feels like it’s worth it... first premier class title is still baby valentino who isn't really deliberately picking fights and is more genuinely hurt by what he believes is marc playing dirty, so it's all less deliberate and calculating. but from then on you do see this pattern a lot I reckon

in terms of fallout, obviously you’d have to assume their popularity would be at least a little more balanced - and at the very least there’d be more national loyalty from the spanish here (boo!! vale!! at!! jerez!!) BUT valentino is just very good at the charm offensive… all the quirky celebrations, plus everyone loves an underdog who takes on the big bad dominant athlete of the time… idk, I reckon he might still get the love of the masses. if their relationship completely deteriorates in 2001, that feels like disproportionately it gets uglier for marc. but it's too much for both of them!! valentino gets a bit spooked in a way he didn't irl after the biaggi rivalry… he really did like marc and against biaggi he did just end up being everyone's sweetheart ridwe in a way he can't quite pull off against another young star… and it's just all so polarising! the factionalism takes valentino aback a bit - I still think it's worse for marc, but valentino goes. hey. this isn't fun any more :(

and oh, by the way, valentino switches to repsol honda for the 2002 season

everybody is extremely hype to see what the two do to each other as teammates, Will They Murder Each Other, but they are initially disappointed… contrary to popular perception, valentino is in fact capable of biding his time, and he goes into that season deciding it’s in his interest to Not have any more drama - which marc broadly agrees with him on. this detente doesn’t last long, obviously, but I feel like this is the time period where they're both a bit more settled, a bit more consistent, less susceptible to complete head loss, can really go at it in the championship... you get a couple close title fights here I reckon, ones where they're trying not to reawaken the feud between each other but... hey, let's say they actually have a crash where they take each other out (the one thing they canonically did not get to do!!) while fighting for position. massively try to downplay it afterwards, they're both hard racers after all :))) but everyone kinda knows it's only so long until this goes badly again. except at the same time they're kinda forcibly exposed to each other a lot in their capacity as teammates and they remember how they were actually Friends and the line between pretending to enjoy each other's company and not pretending is blurred... and the initial drama wasn't as bad as sepang 2015 (also helps valentino that he won the equivalent title in this timeline lol) and valentino knows he's going to see so much of this guy... he's someone who doesn't want to spend much of his life in awkward silences... they're kinda destined to be rivals forever and ever and they're also teammates and there was way too much drama... so actually they do get back to a friendly jokey place... is it sincere? is it not? who knows (not them)

dealer's choice who wins these two titles. we can chuck in one of those where valentino wins the major on-track battles but then marc wins the title fairly comfortably or something... valentino would really relish those fights lbr, even when they don't alter the momentum of the season as much as he'd like. maybe they do get a super close title fight for flavour, one where they're both actually consistent and the big on-track battles do make a difference in terms of momentum and all that stuff. crucially! they still have FUN fighting each other! that's the key thing... plus, they have that annoying vibe where they think they're the only guys who can match each other... there's that mutual understanding that's built in the heat of battle, like they're the only one who really gets what the other is all about, nobody else can... if anything, marc is forced to respect valentino even more now that vale has actually managed to beat him over the course of a full season at least once. biaggi is still a personal antagonist for valentino, but even irl he does very much fade as a threat after the first title fight - and it's all kinda defanged by marc's presence. how borderline obsessed valentino ends up with marc. maybe biaggi still ends up being the real title threat in 2001 after marc nukes his hopes early that year, maybe you still have some of that canonical vale/biaggi drama, but by the end of that year it really is more about marc and THEIR whole thing

brief interlude for a list of jibes valentino likes throwing at marc on a semi-regular basis as he gets better at using the media:

inconsistent stewarding: easy one. valentino was canonically an absolute menace in his early days, but by the time they compete in 250cc I’m sure there’s some mildly phrased insinuations that marc really seems to be getting off lightly with his penalties. valentino isn’t as skilled a media operator back in those days - but with marc’s hit rate of controversial incidents, it’s just incredibly low hanging fruit. valentino picks it with ease

Stop Asking Me About Marc: see the biaggi of 125cc thing. valentino gets sick of being constantly compared to marc! he's his own girl! it's what prompts the first insults he lobs in marc's direction, and it becomes a bit of a running theme. it's not even that anti-marc, but the more sick he gets of The Narrative the more implicitly anti-marc it becomes (marc, who's a lot more into the idea that they're Eternal Rivals, doesn't start drama over what valentino says but it just makes him a bit sad :( like HE doesn't have any problem being compared with valentino Actually)

‘woe be on me for taking on Big Honda’: listen, irl obviously valentino was increasingly annoyed in 2003 when both sete and biaggi argued he had the better bike than them because he was in the factory team. irl that ‘satellite team’ of his in 2000-01 barely was an independent outfit. still, would he have hesitated in 2001 to remind people that his number one rival was decked in repsol honda colours and he wasn't? well, probably not. just rhetorical positioning, right - he’s not even attacking marc, he’s just politely questioning whether honda really would prefer the satellite team to win the title and whether that might not have an influence on what bike parts they’re sending to which riders… just mentioning it! just reminding everyone of what an underdog he is! in case anyone had forgotten!

unequal treatment: this type of thing probably wouldn’t stop when valentino switches to the repsol honda squad. also probably would be justified lol - we’ll get to this in a second, but if he's facing a marc who has had time to make this team his own and is going to fight to keep it that way? yeah, hm. the way this works is that marc is waging most of this war behind the scenes and valentino, who'd be constantly on the back foot in this scenario given it never would have really been his team, is repeatedly taking it public. doesn't work particularly well beyond making marc's life more unpleasant - the public takes valentino's side, honda doesn't

'someone doesn’t like a challenge :((': again, the assen 2015 equivalent, where valentino points out their relationship was just fine until he started seriously challenging marc. young!vale doesn’t really have a reputation for being a particularly nasty competitor, especially if the biaggi feud is defanged just a little… so I reckon he could actually pull this off quite nicely. marc does rub a lot of people the wrong way, even without the valentino factor! he's so obviously rough and ruthless and so committed to winning that valentino can easily play victim here

'marc races me differently': basically the silverstone 2016 thing... it's not really something valentino complains about once they're through the 2001 title fight, and there is the understanding that this behaviour is kinda mutual - but valentino does occasionally throw in a snide remark. just to remind everyone that marc treats him differently!! he's extra aggressive with vale!! of course valentino is totally fine and chill with it, just wanted to remind everyone. in case they'd forgotten. just. a. reminder.

of course, there's also another major issue: the unique stresses of the teammate dynamic. here's the big question - does the switch of valentino to yamaha still happen? yeah, sure! I think he could well get flighty. marc would be the established guy within honda and someone that valentino would never be able to completely displace. plus a lot of valentino’s canonical complaints do still hold, about how honda doesn’t care who’s winning as long as it’s a honda, the stifling culture of winning, the joylessness… marc wouldn’t leave honda unless he absolutely has to because he loves that team, that's his home in a way it never is for valentino. but he is also obviously an absolutely awful teammate to have and, bit of a hot take here, when it comes to the development war stuff he kinda is worse than valentino. so you've got marc ensuring vale's input into the development process is constantly ignored, marc's entire team attempting to isolate valentino within honda, and he never does manage to ruin valentino's title hopes entirely, but inevitably the internal war is one valentino never comes particularly close to winning. in real life valentino sticks it out in repsol honda for a grand total of two years, aka the length of one contract cycle, which sounds about right for the length of time that team would survive until they do just start attempting to strangle each other. so vale goes to yamaha! this would not be a pretty divorce, and it would be even more obscenely risky than in real life, flat out insane from valentino. irl people think he's kinda crazy for doing it, in this universe people would think he's just an idiot. how on earth is he planning to beat the marc marquez on a yamaha?

interpersonally, the yamaha switch is. not good vibes. valentino has spent an entire year implying he feels imprisoned in a team with marc (LOVE brno 2003 in this universe), and marc finds this move a) baffling, and b) kinda loser behaviour because valentino can’t handle taking him on in the same team, so he’s essentially conceding the fight to marc. this dynamic is basically two years of marc attempting to bully valentino behind the scenes, trying to make his life hell, just endlessly gnawing away at him, and then valentino's like 'right lads I'm out' and marc goes :( why would you do this :(( I'm losing my main rival :(( I thought you were better than this :( I thought we had something special :(. for valentino, yes partly he's throwing a fit because he knows honda would never choose him over marc, partly it's justifiable frustration at being stuck in very much The Marc Team, but partly it's also kinda... not really fun for him... he does actually want his team to care about him... but honda doesn't care... so that's that

now, realistically, in this timeline marc has zero right to be losing to valentino in 2004 - not with that bike disparity. maybe if he loses his head completely! that’s… hm, 2018!marc, who we know did have some capacity for head loss. if marc builds up an early advantage while the yamaha is still at its dodgiest, it should theoretically be game over. if he does something silly… hey, who knows. that one’s a fun one psychologically because obviously marc would be the overwhelming favourite that year and valentino can completely embrace the underdog role. I do also reckon whoever wins this one, you can have a real big proper falling out either towards the start or maybe even towards the end of the season. it's all more serious now, somehow... being at honda together meant it just kinda felt like they'd be exchanging titles, honda didn't mind who won - but now both manufacturers are super into it, the press is even more into it, they're more into it... it's personal! they both have a point to prove! maybe marc dropped a few kinda mind games-y comments towards the end of their time together that he doesn't get why valentino felt like he had to leave, that it's not really what a rider does when they think they can win in a fair fight, kinda implying maybe valentino thinks he's already won enough titles and knows he isn't beating marc again anyway. valentino responds in a sane and proportionate manner (bottling it all up and then using any controversy that happens the following year to just unleash on marc). let's say marc wins that title (and valentino gets second place just ahead of sete), but valentino wins a big dramatic fight late that season, and there's some kind of justification for him to really lay into marc, to set off the feud all over again... all sets up their title fight the next year, of course

irl this is when they're both at their very best (2005/2019 respectively), so they get to be at their very best here too. in the name of balance, maybe you should let valentino have this one... or maybe not, swap these titles around at will. but if he DID, then he obviously builds that title charge around a big dramatic victory against marc early in the season on spanish soil. it feels lazy to just copy paste jerez 2005 and valentino being booed to this scenario, but let's assume marc does have his canonical early season crash at a friendly track (á la cota 2019) and that valentino does get that big victory at... hm, catalunya (ik, switching jerez for that is very creative) (but at least he can't get skittled by jorge lorenzo in this timeline). and the win is in somewhat controversial fashion and national partisanship is at a high here... canonically, valentino gets more aggressive in his racing during his switch to yamaha out of necessity, though in this world I imagine he would've already gone more extreme earlier while trying to match marc. they both kinda have to be careful to not go... too far, constantly flirting with the limit, exploring how much they can get away with, but they do have a duel here where they really push it. cause some controversy. give the season the right vibe (x)

no misano on the calendar unfortunately for an equivalent marc being booed moment, and I actually quite like the idea they both keep their respective mugello and sachsenring streaks (so no booing a victorious marc at mugello). each of which isn't the favourite track of the other, though vale in particular has had some great sachsenring scraps... and valentino's margin over the field at mugello is way smaller than marc's equivalent margin at sachsenring. but again, mugello's not really a fantastic marc track, and even without facing prime!valentino he didn't win after 2014, so it feels reasonable valentino could still get a bunch of consecutive wins there. I reckon we give marc a donington park victory, which was basically like valentino's second home race and a track valentino did really like. plus the british fans are canonically absolutely out of their minds so it works. the way the timeline works out that would unfortunately steal one of valentino's most iconic wins, but let's not overthink this eh

let's say their interpersonal relationship is actually slightly on the mend again after the nadir of the previous year, but the public has never been more divided... this is basically what everyone had wanted, right? the competition and the racing has never been better bla bla, they're nicely contrasting characters who are both happy to play dirty, and they give the press a lot to work with. (there are also a vocal minority who despise them both for being 'dangerous assholes' but what can you do.) hey, maybe they actually manage a season where they're the only two guys to win races, that would be kinda cool - and if you look at 2005/2019, surely it is possible... (I suppose sete is a bit more competitive here at least than he was irl because valentino has had the decency not to crush his soul.) narratively, of course it's a bit too neat to let them have this showdown just before it goes to shit for both of them, but they're the type of guys to make things narratively pleasing so I'll allow it. two nations divided, plenty of sniping at each other in the press, but #realfans will note they actually start meeting each other's gaze again in pressers and even manage to shake hands... let's say valentino does most of the points damage early that season, bites at marc from a position of strength (or something) to create a bit of a buffer, before running a bit of a defensive campaign, while marc is gradually ramping up the sheer levels of on-track terrorism. valentino does not remember the last time he had an fp2 session where he didn't have a honda-related jump scare. bless

anyway, listen, I don't really care about the order of these titles, beyond it being more fun for our purposes here if they're more or less balanced (though I do think it's neat if valentino is always kinda stuck chasing marc). they never get quite to the same relationship lows of sepang 2015 because, well, you needed a lot of very specific circumstances to get there irl - and I do think them being peers and being more familiar with each other does help... there's also no real power imbalance, or certainly not as extreme. plus, they're kinda aware from early on that they're stuck with each other. they're primed to spend their entire careers as rivals, like it or not! (I imagine valentino would very much Not like that at times.) they are both deeply pragmatic a lot of the time as racers, and valentino in particular would be less inclined to completely burn his bridges in this scenario I reckon. life's easier when you remain civil... and unwittingly they do keep remembering how fond they are of each other

brief interlude to ruminate on how this all actually affects them as people, vs their canon selves!

valentino never gets to be The One Guy in the sport, which does take something away from him in a way... a little less confidence, always a little more to prove. again, I do think he's quite comfortable in that underdog role and manages to make it his own. he's not as popular, he's not singlehandedly breathing new life into the sport... but on the other hand, what do people love more than a great rivalry? people would have gone crazy over them both, and valentino would've taken full advantage, turned them both into even bigger stars... still, there's a little more insecurity in there over his own abilities than there is irl where he was the single lord and master of the sport for years

the thing about marc is that so much of who he is as a racer feels to some extent influence or inspired by valentino that it's kinda tough to imagine who he is without that. then again, having valentino as a peer does allow valentino to still exert some of that influence (if obviously in a different way). they'd learn a lot from each other, at the end of the day - and even if marc doesn't hero worship valentino... he can still think vale's really cool... it's not star struck, but it's maybe a little bit star struck - given valentino is just so different to anyone else marc has ever come across

the power dynamic does change how they both approach the interpersonal relationship too... irl!valentino does really like adjusting his interpersonal warmth settings to what exactly he's attempting to accomplish in any given rivalry at any given point (even though, again, he's not that deliberate with it from the start of his career). but he's also less likely to completely freeze marc out... not for long, not forever. they basically do the 2016-18 cycle several times because they're competitive enough for long enough to be able to do that shit. warm with each other before there's another big fight, again and again

you do flip the dynamic a little bit in that valentino is the one to shape himself in response to marc a bit now... always chasing, perhaps a note of envy, perhaps some resentment of marc's role in the sport... perhaps also wishing he could get some independence, some freedom from marc and this joint legacy (also helps motivate the switch to yamaha). marc is way more into that shared legacy lbr, but they are both the types to get themselves nicely fired up over an enemy... so consciously or subconsciously they do play up that feud at times when it suits them competitively

no sepang 2015 trauma for marc! this valentino stuff might be bad, but it would never be that bad. he's a bit more happy to pick fights! a bit more happy to do his psychological warfare in the open! a little more openly annoying! less worried about how he's being perceived! more willing to meet valentino head on! let the man have some fun

okay. misery town... 2006

so, look, obviously we're applying some artistic license again here if we're keeping both the arm injury and valentino's dramatic last round loss. like, if you really want to get into it, valentino needs to lose the championship to someone and in this universe there's no seat available in repsol honda in 2003 so do you put hayden somewhere else within honda... but after that rookie season does honda still have enough faith to actually promote him... also does it make a difference if he doesn't have valentino there to directly give him advice... also, dani would PROBABLY just be promoted directly to the factory team in 2006... like idk I do feel this universe might kill nicky hayden's career and valentino should reallyyyyyy win this title. but like. fuck it. who cares. there's also a more abstract argument to be made about how irl!valentino does feel that he left something on the table in 2006 (personally I think it's one of his most impressive seasons but sure, I do get what he's saying) - but surely you wouldn't be 'complacent' in the same way if you hadn't won the last five titles? but again. nobody cares. let's assume they both still have broadly the same year they had irl, partly because there is something.... pleasing? sad? about how the ages DO actually match up here in terms of when their domination of the sport kinda collapses (if to completely different degrees). which would be a massive shock for the sport, right! both of those things irl are already a big shock, but if you have two super dominant forces you would kinda assume one of them would be able to pick up the pieces in any given year, even if the other falters? especially if 2005 was like, this ultra dominant season from the pair of them! but no, suddenly they're both diminished, maybe it is possible for someone else to actually win a title

(another 'fun' coincidence is that jerez is actually the season opener for the very last time in 2006... until 2020. so you can directly layer these races onto each other rather nicely, with valentino's first corner crash and marc's gravel excursion happening at jerez, two early disasters they're attempting to recover from before marc's crash)

on this year:

not really MUCH to say about it on-track if we're assuming it broadly plays out the same...

idk, guess it's about how you want to interpret their relationship. does valentino give marc a call? does he have an aneurysm watching marc attempting to race the following week in *checks notes* qatar? does he get quite stressed out about how cavalier marc is with his own safety, because unfortunately he does care about the guy? does he feel like he's missed his big chance to exploit marc's absence? does the press give him a lot of flak for this? any more insecurities to work through here?

hey, at least there isn't a pandemic in this universe

the thing is, right, if you've spent your entire racing career hunting down this one guy, who's always a step ahead of you, using him as a way to motivate yourself - so much spite, as ever, with valentino to get himself going - and then he just disappears... like they've been sharing the paddock for ten years, for valentino's entire grand prix career. his first memorable battles were against him, he was watching marc win titles in a higher category than vale, then this gradually escalating rivalry with more and more history and hatred and genuine friendship... you kinda inevitably end up defining yourself by the other, right? you can't avoid being shaped by that relationship, by that competitive push and pull. without quite the same interpersonal breakdown... well, valentino is someone who loves to hate his enemies. like, he does enjoy the animosity! he enjoys sniping at his rivals! he enjoys fighting them flat out on the track and off it! and if marc is suddenly gone, he's left feeling bereft. he doesn't get WHY, but he misses him...

marc starts getting long phone calls from valentino where he goes on increasingly incoherent rants about whatever aspect of the sport has annoyed him today. marc doesn't understand what's going on but he's not going to complain. it's a nice distraction

on to 2007! so, obviously the honda in 2007 is better than the honda in 2021, and irl dani does actually end up outscoring valentino by one point (after valentino attempted to ride in valencia with a broken hand and immediately had a mechanical dnf lol). (also idk what to do with the honda situation, let's pretend like honda panicked and created a three man team.) I'm gonna go ahead and say that this version of marc would get considerably better results than 2021!marc, but is not getting particularly close to winning that title. maybe he finishes fourth in the championship idk. he's missing races, honda's definitely not on ducati's level that year, honda/yamaha are still on the michelins at a time when the bridgestones are very much the tyre to be on

one rider who is guaranteed to insert himself into that rivalry in any timeline is, of course, casey stoner. now, casey does get a bit of a grace period from having to deal with marc... marc is absent for his rookie season and is still preoccupied with his injury afterwards. mostly, this is valentino’s problem… but also!! marc can multi-task. so you know how casey complained about valentino hazing him in practise sessions in 2006? and you know how marc would make himself a nuisance in 2019 when following around rookie fabio during quali? and how he followed around his new yamaha hire and rival vinales in pre-season testing in 2017 on a fact finding mission? and how irritated casey was when elias kept following him in successive races in 2007 (see here)? and how much marc was using this tactic post-2020, including by repeatedly picking on new big name pecco? how he generally does this in quite a targeted manner against his main rivals? and how he also tends to do it more when he knows it'll piss people off? so, let’s put all of those things together. how do we think that plays out?

this is why I reckon that despite how casey is nominally fighting valentino for the title, somehow you’d manage to have more open hostilities between casey and marc. again, remember how the casey/vale dynamic went irl: yes, casey was increasingly pissed off by the end of 2007 because he thought valentino wasn’t as nice to him any more and was also annoying in the press about him. but like, relatively speaking… this is still all quite small scale stuff. valentino mostly just does some wink wink nudge nudge stuff to the press that gets back to casey and annoys him because he thinks it’s contributing to an overall unfair narrative about his title… but it’s all still fairly subtle. valentino waits until laguna the following year to go all in, where he completely changes up his on-track tactics and - once he’s got his big win - he really makes sure to rub it in. there's a clear competitive justification for the laguna escalation, but his baseline level of on-track aggression with casey is relatively restrained until that point

by contrast, in this universe you get at least three or four incidents that year where casey extensively complains marc and marc just does the equivalent of a thumbs up (or a literal thumbs up, as he has been known to do). valentino determinedly stays out of it but probably silently enjoys it. by virtue of the negative effect marc and valentino have on each other, racing standards are really not at casey stoner acceptable levels at this time. casey doesn't enjoy valentino's media whisper campaign, but the marc stuff broadly bothers him more... in the races, outside of the races... irl valentino sort of retreated and regrouped late 2007, early 2008 and was less focused on fighting casey, more focused on exerting pressure on yamaha and figuring out the tyre switch he'd forced through. marc does NOT have a title fight to worry about and can instead dedicate himself to making a nuisance of himself. the thing is, casey is generally more inclined to expressing his annoyance through the media than on-track (unless he literally punches you, which he has of course done), so that's probably one of those weirdly one-sided situations where marc does drive casey absolutely insane but also doesn't really talk about it publicly while casey. does

all that being said, I don't really see any reason why casey wouldn't still win that 2007 title pretty handily, which brings us on to 2008. marc goes off halfway through to get his arm fixed, so no tricky title fight questions there. MY main question is whether he mimics valentino in switching to bridgestones. (irl!dani was still on michelins for like. most of the season until they pissed him off so bad he made the switch, which basically made a bunch of riders copy him and kinda brought about the single tyre era lol.) I think he does! bit awkward with michelin (as it was for valentino), but I reckon he'd also subscribe to the principle of wanting to take on his rivals on equal footing - and even if the tyres don't make as much of a difference as valentino says, at least everyone's in the same boat. so maybe that already kinda kills off the michelins at the start of 2008... and it's almost an act of silent solidarity, like marc has had an on and off enough 2007 that he's not fully on top of where he can make the michelins work and where he can't, and honda's telling him to stick with what he's got, but he's looked at what valentino's doing and gone. eh. if he can't do it then maybe it is a better idea to switch, so it's like an unspoken way of showing that he does kinda trust valentino's judgement... (I'm aware the two people still reading this likely don't give a shit about this, but I swear the tyre thing was a big enough deal that it does have major characterisation repercussions.) so valentino takes that title. you kinda assume marc would have considerably better results on that honda, certainly doesn't just have a single podium, hopefully gets a win somewhere. who knows

I do however have one specific suggestion for 2022-inspired drama

marc takes out defending champion and eventual 2008 runner-up casey lap one of his comeback race. valentino sends him flowers

brief interlude to talk about rivals!

again, think the main thing with biaggi is that it just takes a bit of attention away from the whole thing... the feud still happens because it's a rivalry between two italians that gets a lot of press hype, and valentino still doesn't shy away from pissing biaggi off - but there's still less of a spotlight on it. and yeah, wouldn't just be valentino who gets into some feisty exchanges with biaggi, looking at biaggi's track record

I feel bad for doing sete dirty up until now, so as the number one sete gibernau scholar currently active on this website (and quite possibly any website), I do need to address the sete question. the thing is, right, the appeal of the sete rivalry in canon is that it's kinda like. valentino fighting his internal demons. trying to figure out the honda thing. fighting sete who is a way of externalising the internal demons. inevitably, having a straightforward number one enemy and friend and rival and object of his obsessions does kinda distract from sete? who has to play the third man role in that dynamic, and finds it tougher to asset himself in any title fights (especially if we give 2004 to marc in a fairly straightforward manner)

I think sete would still have dramatic on-track battles with both of them! but it's also different if those fights don't have quite the same Implications, because the media narrative around them ends up being completely different. sete isn't being used to judge whether valentino is washed or not, basically

valentino/sete friendship saved!!!!

maybe sete wins the 2006 title for gresini in this timeline idk. sorry sete unfortunately I don't think u get cursed in this timeline :(

and now to the most important question: does casey prefer marc or valentino before he joins the premier class? so u can kinda go both ways on this... on the one hand, I think casey is more directly inspired by marc's style. also, he's a big fan of dominance, and the way this works out in my head is that marc does have more 'dominant' wins than valentino where he just comfortably gaps the field

then again... valentino does tend to go that extra step on the interpersonal stuff, is a bit friendlier with a bunch of riders including the up-and-comers, just generally more outgoing than marc is. (yes, I realise marc being more closed-off is partly the aftereffects of sepang 2015, but it's also a vibe idk. valentino is aggressively a people person, marc is charismatic but is really only interested in about four people at any given time.) plus, you've got the australian connection via valentino's crew chief, and vale probably does have a somewhat better reputation than marc in terms of being a dickhead on-track?

I reckon casey is fairly neutral on this rivalry and cites them both as inspirations in the generic sense, but does get on with valentino a touch better before they become rivals

he does end up kinda hating them both

valentino subconsciously probably does benefit from the emergence of casey as someone he can actually focus some negative energy on in marc's semi absence. gives him some fire again... gets him out of his funk... at heart he's a hater

maybe casey's relationship with valentino is a little better than irl because valentino is no longer the sole representative of everything that's wrong with the sport. like, you still get mad about laguna, right, but then you're also being crashed out by marc on the first lap of his post-injury comeback a couple of races later... like I said. he hates them both

casey already wants to unionise along age lines irl, in this universe he's lobbying for a new rule to force riders to retire at age 27

dani's a fun one, because inevitably he does kinda have a rough time of this scenario. first of all, he's not really honda's golden boy in the same way any more. you've already got marc. second of all, it's not completely implausible marc would've quietly tried and failed to block dani from joining the team at all

I actually think if you put those two respective versions of marc and dani against each other... more beef? puig surely becomes a bit of a nightmare in that team, even more than irl, constant ugly press briefings and insinuations that marc has developed this bike to shit (obviously would be ironic given what a marc... propagandist? puig became in irl post-2020 but y'know)

kinda like a worse version of the dani/hayden dynamic that's also a fusion with marc's dynamic with his post-2020 teammates, where it's just interpersonally quite cold and frigid and there's a lot of scrapping about who gets to lead the team in bike development. not ACTIVELY hostile 'let's kill each other on-track' but not really good vibes

is jorge lorenzo a marc fan in this universe? .... or. actually. is he more likely to be a proper valentino fan? canonically, the being a biaggi fan thing was a bit of contrarianism from jorge - but if you're going to be contrarian against the guy who is winning everything in this universe, it'd primarily be against marc. also, presumably a lot of his immediate circle would root for marc on the basis of national loyalty, so maybe that... could push him in valentino's direction?

on the flip side, if valentino is more popular, maybe he goes marc. god knows, maybe he'd still be a biaggi fan, but I kinda feel like this version of motogp in the noughties you have to choose a side. I think you can make a case for either direction

not that it really matters... if we're still slotting jorge into valentino's team, he was more committed to keeping that relationship respectful than with his other rivals, which.... uh. hate to say it, but I reckon you could give marc and jorge early beef too?

kinda depends, because there's only an overlap of two races where marc is back and before jorge is crashing himself to pieces in his rookie season, so he'd have to strike FAST. then again, he managed to piss off both dani and casey during that time period! he's efficient!!

still, long term jorge's number one priority remains valentino, and that's also where the more serious drama would likely originate

anyways!! one more year and then we're 'up to date'. honestly, there's no elegant way to integrate 2009 and 2023, so just do whatever really. the issue here is obviously the honda... which did have some proper gremlins in 2009, but like, normal gremlins not 2023 honda gremlins. obviously, if marc injures himself a bunch, he's not in the title fight, but presumably he's not injuring himself as much and not as reckless in frustration if he's not on that bloody murder honda. you could have him play the sepang 2015-lite role in the jorge/valentino title fight? I seem to remember the commentators at some point in 2009 saying that valentino had talked about how dani might end up playing a significant role in the title fight by way of like, taking points from the others in crucial places (something like that, I'm sure he phrased in a way that sounds less condescending). irl 2009 is a bit meh as a season apart from like. seven interesting races. (jerez le mans mugello catalunya sachsenring phillip island sepang iirc, and three of those are wet races.) so adding in extra marc marquez would probably spice up the product at least a little bit? a fit marc would presumably be in that title fight but y'know, given the yamaha was the best bike that year (apart from maybe the ducati, casey seems to think that was the best bike they ever made but who knows), maybe it still ends up being very much an intra-yamaha war. not super committed to any particular title fight scenario that season idk

and on the interpersonal relationship post-2006:

man the aliens getting involved does make it more complicated. over the course of his career, valentino generally doesn't really deliberately escalate feuds when he's not fighting someone directly for a title? of course there's a very obvious exception to this rule who is relevant here

I think to both of them it's still the Special Rivalry, even though valentino does not embrace it to the same extent as marc does. but subconsciously he still does embrace it...

they do have this fun thing where they very clearly race each other differently than they do anyone else (excepting days when valentino has something special cooked up for casey)

realistically obviously these on-track battles happen less because we are now in a dire dire era for racing that can't entirely be blamed on the riding styles of the other three aliens. but like I'm sure they still manage twice a year at least to cook up something fun

I've turned this around in my head a few times now and I... just don't really see valentino starting shit with marc during this era? and because he is a bit more the active instigator in that dynamic, but he'd be more inclined to brush off whatever shit marc is sending his way... I kinda think they'd be fine here? if anything, you might get to this slightly absurd place where it essentially mimics the 2013-14 vale/marc dynamic where they do low-key back each other up whenever a dispute rocks up. deeply confusing to anyone who has been around to see the years and years of relentless toxicity to see them repeatedly publicly agreeing like this

but like? if the other aliens (especially casey and dani) complained about marc and valentino's riding style...? hey maybe we get some good old-fashioned generational warfare, marc and valentino both going fuck them kids

also again as a baseline dynamic, they are fond of each other... they may have a lot of problems, but the interpersonal chemistry isn't one of them. if this is a period in which valentino is racking up a couple more titles and marc isn't, obviously this would be like. deeply distressing to marc. but also again I do feel you'd need two parties to escalate this feud again and I just don't think valentino would?

world peace era

kinda the question, right... irl you have 2018 as a new nadir and then the relationship edges back towards civility in 2019, minus isolated spats... and then you have enforced separation by way of covid/injury and that's kinda it for their interpersonal interactions. but in this universe, they do just... keep interacting... also they have so much more history with each other! less hero worship less active betrayal but more just them being teenagers who got drunk together a lot. they'd figure it out again imo!! it's still weird and loaded because they're both ultra competitive, but at the end of the day throwing in a bunch of other rivals into the mix makes them think about how maybe they do actually like each other a whole lot

and the injury does spook valentino... marc was suddenly gone... marc keeps hurting himself... canonically, valentino does show some real concern about marc's antics in 2012 - and okay, here valentino isn't the older one and isn't as traumatised and still believes in his own immortality a little more, but he's still not marc. and marc makes a stupid, reckless decision, and he leaves valentino... given how long they have been friends in this universe, it's just about enough of a scare that it maybe prompts valentino to reevaluate that relationship just a teensy bit? not enough to hold too firm in the face of competitive pressures, but enough to make valentino worry a little more about marc hurting himself than he's worried about marc being the biggest star in their world or their legacies being tied too closely together or whatever... and marc does infuriate him in this, but he does also care...

after this, you would have to get more creative with this universe. valentino breaks his leg, I guess. obviously, marc is not riding a satellite ducati. does valentino still go to ducati in this universe? who wins any of the titles going forward? do you really want to steal any of jorge's titles? what about casey? what happens when we hit the 2013 onwards stretch? idk I'll revisit this in three years time to compare and contrast with what happens irl in marc's timeline (psst since he's currently as old as vale was in 2010.... casey/marc teammate feud starts next year....?) and decide how to forcibly graft that onto this timeline. I'm not really attached to specific title numbers.... going forwards, you can have them compete 4eva - fuck the other aliens - or have only marc win titles or neither of them wins any more titles and that's that. who's to say!

CONCLUDING THOUGHTS

so... like... what does this alternate universe change? obviously there's a bunch of cool on-track battles that would've been neat to see. they're both just fun racers to watch - with very different styles that match up very nicely - and of course the thought of both of them in their prime slugging it out week after week is tantalising in itself. I do think in general, valentino doesn't match marc's aggression as much as he assen 2015's his way through his problems... but also, you'd get some fun 'wow you've both taken each other out' races where both feel like they can't get away with yielding to the other. also, one of my favourite things about sports rivalries is how the way they engage with each other changes over time, how each new encounter inevitably in conversation with all the past fights they've had. in this universe you end up with a bigger sample size inevitably than irl (though honestly the irl one compares pretty positively with a lot of rivalries this century in terms of quality of on-track competition), plus it's over a larger time span. what do they learn from each other? what tricks do they pick up? how does that dynamic change over time? the most obvious shift informed by real life is that [2000 -> 2001] [2014 -> 2015] you go from marc winning the proper battles to valentino winning the proper battles, which helps bring about the marc head loss that season as valentino gets more comfortable with the bikes and the premier class and marc struggles for the first time. where you go from there... again, tbh it's dealer's choice, but the key thing is you have that dynamic of constantly revisiting old haunts and old battles and building on their history more and more and more... it's also super formative and constant for both of them in a way that none of their actual irl rivalries can quite be, like something that caries through from 125cc to 250cc to the premier class?? kids crashing into each other in 1996 and revisiting that same track in 2009 to fight it out again? they end up just sharing a lot with each other that completely eclipses any other on-track rivalry

but there's something... hm, I do really like the generational aspect of marc/valentino and to me it's one of the most interesting aspects of that rivalry, so I'm almost loathe to strip them of that, which is obviously why I've written a reasonable length tumblr post about this. when you make them peers, marc cannot steal valentino's moves, he can't supplant him, he won't have this hero worship that makes him construct himself in valentino's image. you kinda want to find a way to maintain aspects of that dynamic, right, where marc still sees valentino as like. the coolest thing ever. and doesn't model himself after him as much as admire him, sometimes from closer and sometimes from afar... valentino's always making racing fun - which it obviously is to marc too, marc's also a cheery kid, but they are a bit different in how... y'know, marc's constantly inventing new ways to overcome the pain barrier whereas valentino looks at all the more unpleasant aspects of racing and goes 'no thank you <3' (one of my favourite anecdotes about young valentino is what a wimp he was about the rain, which never quite went away). also they come from different enough backgrounds, valentino with his deeply laissez faire parents where he had to grow up quickly himself and occasionally parent them, marc with his deeply not laissez faire parents where the growing up is a bit more about the money of it all but he's still fairly sheltered and living the Professional Child Athlete Lifestyle... and whenever they're not actually racing each other, marc can still construct a bit of an idealised version of valentino in his own head, where he doesn't as much want to be him as he wants to be around him. the reflected glow of all that joy

you tease out the most interesting elements of valentino's side of the equation by going all in on the resentment imo. marc might not be replacing him in this universe, the stuff he 'has' in this universe is fundamentally stuff valentino can take from him if he's good enough... but marc's just everywhere, isn't he? always a little ahead, always seen as the next big thing, burns bright very very early. valentino wants his own legacy! he wants to be his own guy! but he's also a storyteller, and there is a story to be told here... one about how he's just a girl, in a big big world, taking on the big bad marc marquez. so in his head he'd just love to get rid of marc, but also he gets to this weird place where he kinda needs him.... he ends up defining himself against marc, both in the public's eye and in his own mind. they're both each other's biggest points of reference, to where they're eventually each other's only reference. and just like in real life, valentino never quite escapes how all this resentment stems from self-recognition... it's resentment based on how similar they are and how unfair it is that there's someone who's this good who's this much a match for valentino... all because they're similar enough in their approach to competition, grinning while twisting in the knives, vicious in the heat of battle... and because they do both fundamentally want to have fun! so sometimes valentino might love to hate marc but mostly he just loves to fight him...

anyway. what would this timeline adjustment actually add beyond a bunch of on-track battles? I think the main thing you get here is the kinda.... intimacy... from having been teenagers at the same time, having been given the time and space to actually build up a relationship as peers that constantly gets chipped at and reconstructed again and again and again. they kinda function as each other's foils, which they do anyway but here it's from a position of equality. irl, you actually have to jump through some major narrative hoops to even put them both in a position where they'd consider becoming friends (thanks real life for jumping through those hoops). you don't have to do that in this universe! valentino did get more cynical about being both friends and rivals over time (or at least that's my theory, see here) - but when he's a teenager, he's not going to be cautious in the same way! if he likes marc, which the evidence we have suggests he very much would, he'd just be friends with him! the normal way! valentino isn't prepared for the entire thing turning ugly because he's never done this before, there's no past experiences he'd be drawing on here and would be inspired by in starting feuds with his friends-turned-enemies. they'd both be young and innocent and kinda get into the process of feuding in an organic manner, as it should be

and, yeah, the other element is that valentino... well. look. he's really not the fully formed package at the start of his career, including when it comes to media manipulation. but it's always in there somewhere... there's something fun about this being baby's first feud! irl he kinda stumbles into the biaggi one, right, where he says some shady stuff about biaggi and then he's like 'wait a moment the journalists actually report on what I tell them??' and then it escalates from there. very trial and error! in this universe, valentino can trial and error this feud, where he just says some kinda feisty stuff to the press about how he doesn't always want to be compared to marc marquez and maybe they should be asking marc about him, y'know, the cocky little shit - and the public animosity comes and goes in waves where they have one serious spat in the lower categories, then patch it up again, then a proper feud, then it gets better again, then more feuding, etc etc etc.... and in all of this, they're both very into using the media as the way to litigate this feud - especially when they really aren't speaking to each other. and valentino's occasionally quite deliberately drawing the public to his side to make marc's life less pleasant, which he gets better and better at as the years pass. valentino does help turn marc into a bit of a heel, someone the public loves to hate and to root against. (though, again, it is very very important to me you get some crowds booing valentino.) marc's just too good! too vicious! and unlucky to have valentino, the people's princess and poor wee underdog, as his primary rival! but even then, because valentino is younger and less jaded, there's also a level of hostility that he would shy away from. and the fact that they're so inescapable to each other also helps the feud die down each time. because you don't want every single podium until the end of time to be unbearably awkward...

in a way. the direct competition does make things more vicious but more straightforwardly so? and in a more equal way. broadly speaking they do have a better shot of figuring things out in this world imo! maybe valentino finds a qatar 2004 equivalent to burn everything to the ground, but I reckon he flirts with that line without quite crossing it... they have more argentina 2018 equivalents, stuff where one of them (probably marc) does something insane on the track and one of them (probably valentino) says something insane off it... but that's a bit more straightforward! what really makes sepang 2015 so fucked is that it's not a direct title fight between the two of them, like that's why it's the wound they can't heal from! irl it's almost like a commentary on the age gap, right, that they're barely overlapping in competitive windows and how the feud itself can't stem from something so direct... it had to happen in a more roundabout way that allows it to curdle into something far crueller and far more bitter... but the moment you make them peers, then it's all fair, really - a lot of the stuff they do to each other is more 'acceptable' and just part of being rivals and easier to eventually look past. (cf how they're both mostly still focused on sepang 2015 to this day, not argentina 2018.) for better or for worse, they're trapped with each other... irl, part of the unequal power dynamics stem from the simple fact that valentino was integral to marc's childhood but marc wasn't to valentino's. marc can't escape valentino not only because of their shared history, but also because valentino was such a big part of growing up, of figuring out who he'd become... hero worship as a formative process - where however marc feels about valentino now, there's still elements of his identity as a racer and as a person that are inexorably linked to valentino. but here, when they're peers, neither of them can escape that - and when nostalgia comes calling, it does so for both of them. valentino can't just dismiss marc as part of his story, because marc has managed to so thoroughly make himself a part of it. which can make everything worse between them too... and they know each other so thoroughly they'll figure out some nicely brutal ways to hurt each other, again and again and again. they're so similar, so combustive, stuck with each other for so long that they can trial so many flavours of cruelty. but hey, let's be optimistic, just this once. they can't escape each other so they might as well learn to forgive each other

[the-autistic-agoraphobe]

Very well said Long John. I 100% agree with you. Recently I have been thinking alot about how society doesn't seem to value non oral communication as much as oral communication even though some disabled people can't speak at all or find speaking very difficult.

I hear of parents being disappointed about never been able to hear thier child say "I  love you mummy" but it's just as good to see or hear the child tell their mum that they love them with alternative means of communication such as signing, typing, writing or saying it through an ACC device.

I also recently saw a video online when a speech therapist told a young boy to say his name. He said it through his ACC device. The speech therapist told him to say his name with his mouth and made him say his name five times in order to receive a sticker. This Video gave me some food for thought. Would it be that bad of a thing if that boy grew up and used an ACC device instead of his voice as a fully grown man? I personally don't think so. The boy should be allowed to communicate in the method that he is most comfortable and people need to accept that some people communicate differently.

I also hear stories from the Deaf community about Deaf/deaf children being born to hearing families and being denied access to sign language. Spoken language is not very efficient for Deaf/deaf people as lip reading is very difficult and hearing devices don't restore normal hearing. Signing is much more efficient and allows Deaf/deaf children to communicate. I have been learning Auslan (Australian Sign Language) for some time now and it is fun to learn. I recommend learning the sign language that is used mostly in your country.

These are a few examples of how society doesn't value alternative forms of communication as much as oral communication. There are more examples on which I would like to talk about in the future. I believe society needs to change their perception on alternative forms of communication and accept that some people communicate in different ways.

Image Description:

Long John is a long furby with dark blue ears. He is knitted and his head is yellow at the top and white at the bottom of it. He has a red 3D printed faceplate with holes for his eyes and beak and for his light sensor. His body starts off dark blue than goes dark green than a lighter green than yellow than orange than a brighter orange than lastly Red with a streak of purple. His head is made from a 1998 furby with white eyelids and purple eyes. His feet are light green with red thread separating the toes. He also has a red spot on the green part of his body. Long John is using an ACC device which looks like a tablet to say "Alternative forms of communication are just as valid as spoken forms of communication." He is on a lounge. End Description.

[waitmyturtles]

THE MORNING AFTER: ONLY FRIENDS, EPISODE 6 ("DECIDING IN YOUR YOUTH / ON THE POLICY OF TRUTH") EDITION

In segment 2/4 of this latest episode of Only Friends, Boston let us know what year the show's mind is on.

Some stuff was percolating around this time, some of it majorly important, and other stuff important maybe only to someone like myself, a baby born in the 1980s and raised in the 1990s who happens to have a thing for 20th-century British electronic rock.

In February 1997, the infamous "The One With The Morning After" episode of Friends came out -- when Rachel discovers that Ross had slept with someone else when, "WE WERE ON A BREAK!"

In September 1997, Linda Tripp begins recording her conversations with a White House intern, Monica Lewinsky, about Lewinsky's affair with the U.S. president of the time, Bill Clinton.

In January 1998, the first public news of the Clinton-Lewinsky scandal comes out.

And in 1998, one of my favorite songs ever, "Policy of Truth," is released by one of the greatest bands of all time, Depeche Mode (ya feel me, Sand?). I thought a lot about this song, about the meaning of truth in the hands of young folks, and I thought a LOT about politics, during this episode.

It's just time to pay the price / For not listening to advice / And deciding in your youth / On the policy of truth

Truth, Bill, Monica, cheating, Friends. It's a lot. To me, this episode dealt with politics, with the nature of what "truth" means, what truth means when it is created and/or revealed at a particular point in time, and how young people begin to learn about the correlation between truth and consequences in safe, unsafe, and enduring ways.

We meet Boston's dad, shown above. We see he's got a flavor about him. He's quite casual with his son ("Ton, you dipshit!"). He's borrowing help from his son's friend for campaign materials (ooookay, lol, where is your campaign manager), while smoochin' on a Scotch.

What are campaign materials? Campaign materials -- posters, mailers, policies, commercials, etc. -- are the selling of an image. A political campaign is not quite about truth. A political campaign is a selling of a story that candidates want voters to buy with their votes. It's reality....-ish. It's a kind of truth that is ultimately selective and marketed to a particular voting audience that will hopefully allow that candidate to win and gain power.

There was someone else playing a political game, until his game crumbled. Top was playing a political game.

Before Mew blew Top's shit UP (Mew would have made Linda Tripp proud, goddamn), Top thought his political game was selling. He thought his IMAGE was selling. He thought his secret about his sex with Boston, while him and Top had reset and were not officially boyfriends again ("we were on a break"), was safe.

We saw Top's true nature come out time and time again, to Boston, to Nick, to Sand. We saw his aggressiveness and his confidence, his assuredness about his success as a top-tier man, directed to everyone EXCEPT Mew, with whom Top had to play a different game -- a game of touch-and-go, a game of restraint, a game of change, and certainly a game of withholding and/or manipulating certain truths about himself (Top) in order to continue to win Mew's heart. Before the in-bed blow-up at the end of the episode, Top even planted a guilt trip on Mew -- digging into Mew's continued distrust of Top by asking Mew to PLEASE consider everything that Top had changed for Mew.

Someone else was called out for playing a dishonest political game. Boston calls out Ray for not being honest about his feelings for Mew. Boston says to Ray, as Ray looks on in shock, below:

In this scene, I realized something. The only person NOT playing a game of deception at this point is Boston. Boston -- while an absolute jerk and asshole -- KNOWS he is these things. He doesn't fight off allegations that he is "nasty." He knows what he likes. He is honest about how he acts. He is truthful to his feelings. He is a jerk -- but he doesn't lie. (Or at least, he hasn't lied, yet.) He happens to keep secrets and withhold truths, but he hasn't distorted his image to try to fool anyone -- the way that Top has, the way that Ray has. He is utterly direct about his intentions with Nick, and he leaves it up to Nick to deal with his (Boston's) brutal honesty.

(Before I unwind on Boston to bring together these thoughts on sex, politics, and truth, I want to note that we had two instances of advice from GROWN-UPS -- from the quartet's business professor, and from Sand's mom -- that playing with friendship, work, love, and business, can result in awkward consequences. Finally, we begin to see a creep of the grown-up Greek chorus offering its thoughts on the antics of this group of aloof students who are almost Seinfeld-ian in their disdain of how they may hurt each other, others, and even themselves with their behaviors. This group has decided right now, in its youth, on its policies of truth. And Seinfeld, along with Friends, was the aloof epitome of the 1990s.)

The reason why I interjected that thought on grown-ups and consequences here is that both Boston and Ray had different takes on "truth" in this episode than Top. Like I said: Top has an image that he had been selling to Mew until the very end of the episode.

Boston and Ray, on the other hand, have relationships with truth in which they are unaware of the consequences of their almost thoughtless honesty (and in Ray's case, his simultaneous dishonesty). What do I mean by that?

As I mentioned before: Boston isn't deceitful. He's just brutal. Boston is brutally honest about his feelings and intentions -- and he doesn't realize that people like Nick, or Gap (DRAKE) may interpret sex, and feelings that might come from or after sex, differently than him. And those different feelings, from different people, will almost always have consequences of a kind that Boston is clearly not prepared to deal with. The biological urge that many have to be close or clingy after sex? The implication that if you have sex with someone, that you might automatically be “dating”? The theory that maaaaannny people have that sex is a way INTO a relationship (and not the other way around)? All of these notions need communication. I posit that Boston’s been VERY clear in his communication that he is NOT into ANYTHING related to a relationship—but he’s not aware that others do not think like him, and that WILL have consequences for him.

Ray, in that drunk and high performance of a lifetime at YOLO (cc @liyazaki LOLLLLL), thinks that he's saving his friends with a round of truth-telling. By being so blind to the feelings of others -- and, really, to ignore the rights and privacy of others to deal with their own truths on their own time -- Ray BLASTS past any of consequences that he might face, and that his friends may face, as he reveals their secrets, one by one.

@lurkingshan noted in one of her meta posts yesterday that Mew punched Ray at the bar in part to control the release of the truth of Top cheating on Mew, to leave that little bit out, so that Mew could have his own "gotcha" moment later at home with Top.

You know what that was? That was politics, baby. That was a HELL of a power move, for Mew to literally PUNCH someone out of his way, so that Mew could clinch a win for himself -- vis à vis a brutal truth that very clearly hurt and impacted him, either through his love for Top, and/or through embarrassment for his own reputation, as Shan notes.

I'm gonna tie this ALL together in just a moment -- but I want to make one very last note about the truth and a character. Sand runs to Ray in the parking lot after Ray's blow-up. Sand admits his feelings to Ray. Ray pushes him away and gets behind the wheel. And Sand hops on his bike and follows Ray.

At this point in the series, I posit that Sand knows exactly what he is getting into. (I'm SMDH about it, but he knows what he's getting into, god fucking damn it, SAND, baka.)

He's NOT deceiving himself. He's being honest with his feelings, like Boston is -- but, unlike Boston, I believe Sand is very fully aware of the consequences that his feelings may lead him to face. Remember that Sand is not a part of the original aloof quartet. He's not one with the liars, like Cheum and Ray. He's not one with Boston, who doesn't think ahead. He's not one with Mew, who is insecure, conniving, and now potentially vengeful. Sand, the goddamn romantic, is caught beneath a landslide on a champagne supernova with his feelings, and will clearly ride them out, with intention. (I want to SHAKE HIS DAMN SHOULDERS, but anyway.) (GMMTV, why do you have to play First like this. I just finished Not Me. You took the anarchy outta my boy. Now he’s blubbering for another problematic dude. Can we just. Let. First. I dunno. Anyway.)

So.... whew. What of all of this?

I take this episode as one that says:

Truth is what you make of truth. Truth -- whether it's the presentable truth, the not-totally-complete truth, the whole and unedited truth, or in the words of Californians, your own truth -- will have consequences when it is revealed. And a huge part of maturity is in one's handling of those revelations when they are made.

When you are young, you don't have the benefit of years and years of time and life to recognize that your actions may have consequences, some that are fleeting, some that will last a lifetime. A huge point of one's young adulthood is how you are shaped by the consequences of your actions and your decisions -- and by seeing how your actions affect other people, either intentionally or unintentionally.

Sex and politics rarely, if ever, mix well. For Boston's dad.... what will be revealed about Boston is not gonna be good for his campaign. And Boston's own life may well be impacted for a good chunk of his lifetime.

But, more than anything else, this theme of politics that I saw in this episode reflected for me -- of course, as always -- a kind of ephemerality in this series. You know why?

Politics, unless it is INCREDIBLY corrupt, always has term limits. Unless you're Putin or Mugabe: power unto a leader, or a group of leaders, will almost always come to an end.

The image will fade. The rhetoric will wither out.

The politics will always change -- because people always change, ideas always change.

HOWEVER. The consequences of one's actions in politics may last a lifetime, or lifetimes. If you REALLY fuck up? You’ll be known for that for your life.

The OF quartet is heading into a dalliance between impermanence and permanence, as well as with consequences that their aloofness has not prepared them for, and it's bound to be devastating. Many of them tried to play games in this episode. Almost all of them are unaware that these games will have long-lasting effects. Some of them (like Nick and Sand) are still playing games. And these games, these risks, are bound to end in many of them ending up as losers.

The following rule is NOT ephemeral — it is a permanent truth: in politics, there will ALWAYS be losers. That is always the case, and will always be the case. There are going to be a lot of losers by the time this show ends.

(EPHEMERALITY SQUAD, HAPPY SUNDAY! Thanks for tagging me in your meta yesterday! @ranchthoughts @chickenstrangers @slayerkitty @twig-tea @clara-maybe-ontheroad @distant-screaming @lurkingshan @neuroticbookworm)